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Thread: My biggest pet peeve

  1. #1
    Michael75065 is offline Banned
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    My biggest pet peeve

    My biggest pet peeve


    My biggest pet peeve is the greed that MLM sometimes create in people. Associates think they have tolk to look successful (a complete facade) in order to attract people to their business. Then they make their downline think that is what it takes to succeed. Being in debt up to their eyeballs is not success!

    Also, there are too many companies and upline out there with the attitude of sponsor, sponsor, sponsor. It's like throwing the new recruits up against the wall to see who sticks. I got into it one time with a man who was in one very successful MLM and sold out. Then he bought another company. I went to a meeting he conducted to show the plan and I could hardly stand hearing what he was saying. All he could talk about was sponsor at least 20 people across and then go down. After the meeting, there I was, a small new distributor at my first meeting telling the hot shot he was wrong as we entered the elevator. I told him that is how to alienate family and friends and make people hate MLM. I told him that sponsoring downline to create a tap root builds stability and loyalty. Even though I was not rude and spoke to him with more respect that it sounds like in this comment, I could tell that he didn't like what I said. I felt he needed to hear it and so did the people he was preaching this garbage to as well. To me, it was a matter of principle and ethics to tell him what I knew to be the truth because of my prior experience in a MLM from years earlier.

    What good are tons of downline if you lose 95% of them? I know Verniel Cutar, 95% do fail when they are sponsored like this. Their upline doesn't have time or the resources to adequately train these people and so they die on the vine. The only ones who get the attention are the ones who impress the upline.

    Oh boy did this question get me started...I'm sorry! As you can tell, I feel very adamant about this subject and people like this get my blood boiling. They get people to dream and then they rob them of that dream by not training them right.*

    I know the right way to build a strong MLM business. I did it! I had over 60 people in my organization the first three months of starting to work the business, with 7 personally sponsored. That means I had 53 others by working downline in four legs. Then, in the fourth month I made a huge pay check. Now that is what really fires up people all the way down line. People making money from you all the way down is always better than only the greedy upline sponsoring the world and then leaving them hanging.

    Thanks for giving me the opportunity to voice these peeves of mine.

    Why some people make it in MLM and most don't.
    Please read my blog below


    These examples are case studies, and are not representative of the norm. They've succeeded despite their shortcomings. If it were normal to succeed with these shortcomings, they wouldn't be detrimental qualities in the first place.

    The problem with helping people to get what they want, again, is that the rank and file in MLM get in with practically no sales and marketing education/experience. It's the blind leading the blind in most cases.*

    MLM educational tools aren't enough. Required college courses in MLM business practice or something similar as a condition of acceptance into the network would be a good start. Anyone can regurgitate internet content in a piecemeal fashion and package it into a CD or book, and sell it to downlines. It hardly makes them a subject matter expert, though.*Verifiable*substantial MLM income for decades, and/or college degrees in business and such would qualify one to be a subject matter expert, not an unknown quantity, someone who professes to do well in MLM, but is most likely following the "fake it until you make it" methodology.

    I find it quite curious that distant uplines profess to be quite well of financially, but cannot produce financial documents to prove such claims. I can say that I'm a level 18 MLM wizard with a $250k income, but that could be a total fabrication. Anyone can lease a sports car for a day, or get their picture taken at a fancy resort down the road from the budget motel they're staying at. Boat excursions can be quite cheap as well. Just get to the meeting before everyone else and hide the beater car a few blocks away, and leave after everyone else. It's real easy to fake affluence.

  2. #2
    Soapboxmom's Avatar
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    Re: My biggest pet peeve

    My biggest pet peeve is MLM whores who try to sneak in ads on our site. That will cease immediately or all your posts will be removed and you will be permanently banned.

    MLM is an inherent fraud. It is a business model that no legitimate university teaches as a viable one. The whole premise of network marketing is recruitment of warm marks. One is encouraged to victimize family and friends in an endless chain scheme. There is little or no retailing. The majority of customers are reps forced to purchase in order to participate in the pyramid pay scam. 97% or more will lose money in the typical MLM.

    http://www.mlmconsultant.com/mlm_law.htm
    The U.S. FTC has been moving steadily toward measuring the amount of Sales to Distributors compared to the dollar amount generated by sales to end consumers (Customers that do not belong to the pay plan). If there aren’t enough Customers, the MLM Company is considered a Pyramid Scheme. Regulators have found that pure pyramid schemes don’t have any end consumer customers. The definition of a Customer is a person that only buys product or services and doesn’t belong to the compensation plan and has no expectation of making money. The FTC Consumer Affairs people said in public speeches (not written rules) that MLM – Network Marketing Companies need to have a minimum of 50% Customers (that do not belong to the pay plan) to prove they are not a pyramid scheme. ....

    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #1

    FTC BURNS BURN LOUNGE!

    The money in Burn Lounge was coming from recruiting.... Not the 50% of income from Customers/Product Sales the FTC wants.....

    CASE #2. In this case with Mall Ventures in 2004 the FTC took court action but did not shut the company down.

    CASE #2 PARAGRAPH 9. “Retail Sales” means sales of products, services, or business ventures by defendants, their successors, assigns, agents, servants, employees, and those persons in active concert or participation with them to third-party end users. Retail Sales does not include sales made by a participant in a multi-level marketing program to other participants, recruits, or the participant’s own account....

    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #3

    The FTC and Federal Marshals walked into SkyBiz offices on 31 August 2001 and shut the company down. This is normal for the FTC since they don’t want to fight the legal power MLM and other types of companies have. They get a preliminary injunction in secret, walk in, and shut the company down.

    This is from 2 Jan 2002 FINDINGS OF FACT AND CONCLUSIONS OF LAW AND ORDER FOR PRELIMINARY INJUNCTION REGARDING SKYBIZ INTERNATIONAL LTD. .For complete case see CD-ROM #1 FTC that comes with the law book. Please note the critical elements (causes for action) presented on pages 14 and 15 of the lawsuit in this case. The third paragraph is the newest refined and the biggest change in the Customer direction for the FTC in determining MLM vs. Pyramid Scheme. The height of humor (or despair) was when SkyBiz sent out this email looking for Customers a couple of days before the trial started. Have a laugh, or frown, Skybiz did not even know if they had customers that were end users! Read This:

    aaa@attglobal.net; Leslie Tumlin (Jack Weinzierl's buddy in Local Ad Link) ; Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2001 12:04 PM

    Subject: Trial Preparation Friends of SkyBiz:



    Urgent To All SkyBiz Members

    We need the names and addresses of EVERY SATISFIED consumer that bought the SkyBiz products and have never sold the business opportunity. We also need the names and addresses of five VERY ZEALOUS Associates who are in the program, but haven't made a whole lot of money. Please keep in mind, we need consumers and associates who would not be reluctant about testifying in court and who presumably are in the United States (for travel purposes). If any of the potential witnesses you suggest are outside the U.S., please identify what country they're in. I need this information at your earliest convenience. Thank you.

    Martin Allen Brown, General Counsel

    SkyBiz

    World Service Corporation

    (Author Note) In this following paragraph, the FTC shows it’s push for “retail sales to customers who don’t belong to the pay plan.”

    CASE #3 PARAGRAPH 15. A lawful multi-level marketing program is distinguishable from an illegal pyramid scheme in the sense that the "primary purpose" of the enterprise and its associated individuals is to sell or market an end-product with end-consumers and not to reward associated individuals for the recruitment of more marketers or “associates” See Gold Unlimited, 171 F.3d at 483-84 (suggesting that based on a statutory survey of state criminal laws against pyramid schemes, this is a difference). See also Ger-Ro-Mar, Inc. v. FTC, 518 F.2d 33. 36 (2d Cir. 1975) (explaining that the distributors profited by earning commissions from their own sales and those of their recruits); In re Amway Corp., 93 F.T.C. 618, 716 (1979) (sponsors do not make money from their recruits' efforts until a newly recruited distributor begins to make wholesale purchases from his sponsor and sales to consumers) ....

    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #4

    FTC Press Release: Consumers paid a registration fee to join the NexGen program, and most also purchased a “WebSuite” including the Internet Mall and related goods and services. A “Basic WebSuite”cost $185, including the registration fee, and a “Power Pack WebSuite” cost $555. NexGen allegedly claimed that “each activated business center has the potential to earn up to $60,000 per week.”

    CASE #4 PARAGRAPH 24. NexGen also paid commissions to affiliates on purchases from Internet merchants that resulted from visits to the affiliates' malls. Similarly, affiliates earned commissions from purchases directed to third-party Internet merchants as a result of visits through the malls of their downline. The commissions NexGen paid on these purchases were relatively small compared to the commissions it paid on sales of websuites to new recruits....

    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #5

    CASE #5. In the “BigSmart” case, you can see that the FTC is refining its wording of end user and customer. This was a walk in and shut down operation by the FTC and Federal Marshals. You can see some outline of changing requirements:

    CASE #5 Subparagraph C. “Prohibited marketing scheme,” means a pyramid sales scheme, Ponzi scheme, chain marketing scheme or other marketing plan or program characterized by the payment participants of money to the program in return for which they receive (1) the right to sell a product or service and (2) the right to receive in return for recruiting other participants into the program rewards which are unrelated to the sale of products or services to ultimate users. Rewards are “unrelated” to the sale of products or services to ultimate users if rewards are not based primarily on revenue from retail sales.

    CASE #5 Subparagraph D. “Retail Sales” means sales of products, services, or business ventures by Defendant, his successors, assigns, agents, servants, employees, and those persons in active concert or participation with them to third-party end users. “Retail Sales” does not include sales made by participants in a multi-level marketing program to other participants, recruits, or to such a participant’s own account.

    CASE #5 Subparagraph E. “Ultimate users” are purchasers of retail sales.......
    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #6

    On December 9, 1999, the FTC filed suit in U. S. District Court for the District of Maryland seeking a preliminary and permanent injunction and a legal asset freeze against Dallas-based 2Xtreme Performance International that was a Pyramid Scheme (bad one) disguised as an MLM – Network Marketing Company. The FTC legal complaint alleged that the defendants used Web sites, direct mail, infomercials, telemarketing and seminars to convince consumers they could make substantial income by investing in their multi-level marketing scheme, which marketed nutritional supplements, beauty, weight-loss and other products. Marketing materials represented that consumers could expect to earn enough MLM – Network Marketing income to retire in two years, while the pseudo MLM Company ripped them off for $10,000 - $30,000. We can see the shaping of precedent law in the following paragraph. The Final Settlement said:

    CASE #6 Subparagraph F. “Prohibited marketing program” means any marketing program, Ponzi scheme, chain marketing scheme, or other marketing plan or program in which a person who participates makes a payment and receives the right, license or opportunity to derive income as a participant primarily from: (i) the recruitment of additional recruits by the participant, program promoter or others; (ii) non-retail sales made to or by such recruits or their recruits; or (iii) any other payments made by recruits. For purposes of this Final Order, a "prohibited marketing program" does not include a marketing plan or program in which the program promoter demonstrates to the defendant that it has instituted and enforced rules that have the actual effect of ensuring that the participants in the program derive income from the retail sale of goods or services to persons who are end-users of the goods or services and who are not participants in the program....

    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #7

    The FTC charged that income from the FutureNet multilevel marketing plan did not depend on sales of the Internet devices they were purportedly selling, but rather on the recruitment of new distributors -- the typical profile of an illegal pyramid....

    FEDERAL MLM - TO PYRAMID CASE HISTORY JEWELWAY INTERNATIONAL

    "CUSTOMERS" CASE #8

    In a pyramid scheme there is almost no emphasis on making retail sales of products to persons who are not participants in the program. According to an FTC expert, earnings claims made in conjunction with promoting a pyramid scheme are false because pyramids inevitably collapse when no new participants can be recruited and approximately 90% (or possibly more) of the participants consequently lose their money..... CASE #8 PARAGRAPH 15. A lawful multi-level marketing program is distinguishable from an illegal pyramid scheme in the sense that the "primary purpose" of the enterprise and its associated individuals is to sell or market an end-product with end-consumers and not to reward associated individuals for the recruitment of more marketers or “associates”

  3. #3
    Soapboxmom's Avatar
    Soapboxmom is offline Administrator
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    Re: My biggest pet peeve

    Quote Originally Posted by Soapboxmom View Post
    My biggest pet peeve is MLM whores who try to sneak in ads on our site. That will cease immediately or all your posts will be removed and you will be permanently banned.

    MLM is an inherent fraud. It is a business model that no legitimate university teaches as a viable one. The whole premise of network marketing is recruitment of warm marks. One is encouraged to victimize family and friends in an endless chain scheme. There is little or no retailing. The majority of customers are reps forced to purchase in order to participate in the pyramid pay scam. 97% or more will lose money in the typical MLM.

    http://www.mlmconsultant.com/mlm_law.htm
    You were warned and yet you persisited in putting this same post and numerous other duplicate posts on the forum. Your a$$ is banned permanently! See ya!

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