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Thread: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

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    Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Cornuke

    Bob Cornuke (born 1951) is a controversial American writer and amateur archaeologist. Cornuke is president of the Bible Archaeology Search and Exploration Institute (BASE), which is operated from his home in Colorado Springs, Colorado.[1] He describes himself as a Biblical archaeologist, but has no degree or training in archaeology.[1]
    Contents


    [edit] Background and explorations

    He holds a Masters of Arts in Biblical Studies and a Ph.D. in Bible and Theology, both from the unaccredited Louisiana Baptist University.[2][3] He has been a police officer in Costa Mesa, California. He is the author of six books about his explorations over the last 20 years. Archaeologists and other critics characterize his approach of using of the Bible as a literal guide for his explorations as pseudoarchaeology.
    Cornuke is travel guide/business partners with Chuck Missler.[7] Cornuke received credits at Missler's unaccredited Koinonia Institute, which were transferable to the unaccredited Louisiana Baptist University.[3] Missler is a 1999 graduate of Louisiana Baptist University, and currently Cornuke in Colorado, a 2005 graduate, and Missler in Idaho are professors at the "school."
    Cornuke also makes a claim of discovering[4] the anchors from the Apostle Paul’s ship wreck, as described in the Bible's Book of Acts, chapter 27 — by searching the sea floor off the coast of Malta.
    His most recent expeditions were to Takht-i-Suleiman in Iran in July 2005 and June 2006, where he discovered a rock formation approximately 400 ft long at 13,120 ft (4,000 m) elevation. Cornuke's search appeared on Fox News,[5] CNN,[6] and Good Morning America[7] as well as others.
    [edit] Mount Sinai

    Cornuke's book, In Search of the Mountain of God, claimed he was the original researcher of the biblical match of Biblical Mount Sinai to Jabal al-Lawz in Saudi Arabia. Earlier, however, in 1984, Ron Wyatt had already claimed to be the discoverer of the Biblical Mount Sinai at Jabal al-Lawz[8], and in 2002 Randall Styx noted that Harry St. John Philby claimed such evidence in his 1957 book The Land of Midian[8]
    Author Gordon Franz claimed that Cornuke, "had forged a letter from the King of Saudi Arabia in order to obtain a visa into the Kingdom,"[9] and wanted to debunk Wyatt's, Cornuke's and Williams' claim that the Biblical Mt. Sinai was in Saudi Arabia. Franz argued that the "biggest problem with the identification of Mt. Sinai at Jebel Al-Lawz is that it does not meet the Biblical criteria for the site. These claims are based on three challenged assumptions and a supposed misunderstanding of the archaeological remains that they observed."[9] The three assumptions were: 1) the Sinai Peninsula was within the territorial borders of the Land of Egypt, 2) "that Mt. Sinai is located in the Land of Midian, which is identified as part of the Saudi Arabian peninsula," and 3) "Apostle Paul says in Gal. 4:25 that Mt. Sinai was in Saudi Arabia."[9]
    Cornuke responded to Franz's accusations by calling him to "honestly examine and evaluate the [credible] historical, geographical, archeological and Biblical evidence that Jabal al-Lawz might be the real Mount Sinai"[10]. Allen Kerkselager, Ph.D. Professor of Theology St. Joseph's University stated "Jabal al Lawz may also be the most convincing option for identifying the Mt. Sinai of biblical tradition" and should be researched.[11] Meanwhile Roy Knuteson former Professor of New Testament and Greek and Bible Archaeology at Northwestern College explained, "None of the suggested sites in the Sinai Peninsula fit the biblical requirements.[12]
    According to Cornuke, the scholar Frank Moore Cross of Harvard Divinity School[9] supports his Mt. Sinai claims, but according to Franz, "Frank Moore Cross, retired professor of Hebrew at Harvard University opines that the mountain of God was located in the Land of Midian. When asked if he had a guess what mountain might be Mt. Sinai, he responded, 'I really don't'" and Moore "later put the "Midian Hypothesis" in print, but did not endorse any mountains for the location of Mt. Sinai (Cross 1998: 60-68)."[9] Another critic noted the "BASE institute site had some quotes from respected archaeologists which seemed to support the idea that Jebel al-Lawz was a good candidate for Mount Sinai," but, "when I contacted some of these individuals, they assured me they never made such statements, neither did they feel Jebel al-Lawz was the real Mount Sinai."[13] Thus, "it became quickly obvious that some of the information on the BASE Institute site was not legitimate."[13]
    [edit] Maltese

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    In 2002 Cornuke claimed to have found anchors from the Biblical shipwreck of St. Paul. This claim has been disputed, however, with Cornuke being labelled by some as a "con artist" who was claimed "to have found the wreck of Paul's ship from Acts - and then got sued for breaking 'all aspects' of an oral contract with a former US ambassador to Malta."[14] This case was unsuccessful with the judge ruling that the book was already released and could not be prevented from being sold.[15] His critics believe he is "more interested in the money to be gained from their claims than in providing genuine evidence for anything."[14] Cornuke says that these anchors were actually discovered by fishermen years before he went in search of them and had already been recovered.
    Gordon Franz noted Charles Grech (a retired restaurant owner) found a third anchor in front of the same under***** cave that might have been found off the Munxar Reef, but this was not certain. [16] Only one anchor was examined by Anthony Bonanno[17] and it was only examined in Mr. Grech's home.[16] Bonanno believes that anchor appears to be "consistent" with the "era of the shipwreck of St. Paul, in 60 A.D." and "a Roman/Alexandrian grain freighter,"[18] but he did not directly link the anchors with St. Paul.
    Franz unilaterally dismisses every Maltese claim Cornuke has made.[16] Franz has noted "had no tangible proof of the anchor stocks to show the world. The first of the anchor stocks was melted down; the second, third and fourth were in private collections; and the fifth and six had been sold."[16] So Cornuke, with "the aid of the US ambassador to Malta, Kathy Proffitt, was enlisted to convince the President and Prime Minister of Malta to offer an amnesty to anyone who would turn over antiquities found off the Munxar Reef" and the pardons were issued on September 23, 2002." As a result, "two anchor stocks" were "turned over to the authorities."
    Franz questions Cornuke's research in that "Mr. Cornuke does not interact with, or mention, some very important works on the subject of Paul's shipwreck; nor are they listed in his bibliography.".[16] All these scholars have claimed different sites where St. Paul may have been shipwrecked. Gordon also has criticized Cornuke's understanding of the biblical story and description. On August 15, 2005, James Mulholland, a life-long member of the Maltese community and a member of the Pauline Association in Malta, stated that Franz made four errors in his refutation of Cornuke and that Cornuke's evidence was not compelling.[16] Mulholland pointed out three problems with Franz's arguments: 1) That Marsaxxlokk bay was visible from Munxar Reef, 2) That Franz misidentified the Munxar reef referred to by Cornuke, 3) That Franz only dismisses, but does not refute Cornuke's identification of the real Munxar Reef as the location, and 4) while "Mr. Franz makes a compelling argument," but "these ancient sites would have been well-known by experienced sailors."[16] Mullholland concluded, "we could pick each element of Mr. Cornuke's overall theory and propose other locations that could possibly match that single element. However, that's not the appropriate exercise here. The compelling nature of Mr. Cornuke's theory rests in the fact that ALL of the elements come together in one location. I could show you a place on the western side of the island where they possibly meet."[16]
    In 2003 Christianity Today reported that the then U.S. ambassador Kathryn Proffitt sued Cornuke to stop the sale of his book after she arranged for the "Maltese government to pardon the fisherman."[15] (Cornuke would claim these "were from the apostle's ship.") Proffitt contended that as part of the pardon arrangement and several other issues, Cornuke agreed to remain silent about the pardon and "to allow Proffitt and the Maltese government to edit the book. He would also be required to encourage tourists to visit ancient temples."[15] According to some he did not keep his part of the agreement.[15]
    A federal judge denied the request to hold up publication of the book since it was already released at the time. Even still, "what the Maltese government is apparently upset about, however, isn't that Cornuke's book was published without its permission, but that it claims that the shipwreck never happened in the traditional site on the northeastern tip of the island, now known as St. Paul's Bay."[15]
    [edit] Saudi Arabia

    Cornuke and his partner "snuck" into Saudi Arabia illegally.[19] Later on Cornuke falsely told "guards" they were medical doctors after being captured so the Saudi Arabian guards did not consider them Jewish spies.[19] However, "Cornuke found himself in a sticky situation when one by one each guard came to him complaining of various ailments."[19][citation needed]
    [edit] Noah's Ark

    Cornuke's surrogates claimed in June 2006 that Cornuke may have discovered Noah's Ark in a pile of dark-colored rocks on the Iranian Takht-e Suleiman ("Throne of Solomon") or Mount Suleiman in the Alborz (Elborz) Mountains[20]. Cornuke relies heavily on one eyewitness of Noah's Ark, Ed Davis, in which there are problems with him being in Iran let alone at this site when he claimed to see Noah's Ark in 1943[21]. Even creationist geologists doubt whether the rocks viewed by Cornuke are petrified and are urging caution[22]. The research team included Arch Bonnema, film producer of The Genius Club and other well-known Christian businessmen. The oldest creationist organization does not believe the rocks viewed by Cornuke are petrified or Noah's Ark[23]. Even Cornuke himself isn't completely convinced that what he observed was Noah's Ark or even if it was petrified wood. Associates for Biblical Research also produced a 7,800-word paper about problems with the Cornuke site[24]. National Geographic critiqued the rocks at the site[25].
    Bob Cornuke has been involved with some alleged Christian business people which prompted me to contact him. I think a closer look is definitely in order.

    Soapboxmom

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Kate Ravilious
    for National Geographic News
    July 5, 2006

    High in the mountains of northwestern Iran, a Christian archaeology expedition has discovered a rock formation that its members say resembles the fabled Noah's ark. The team discovered the prominent boat-shaped rocks at just over 13,000 feet (4,000 meters) on Mount Suleiman in Iran's Elburz mountain range. (See Iran map, photo, country profile.)

    "It looks uncannily like wood," said Robert Cornuke, president of the Bible Archaeology Search and Exploration Institute (BASE), the Palmer Lake, Colorado-based group that launched the expedition.
    Photos taken by BASE members show a prow-shaped rock outcrop, which the team says resembles petrified wood, emerging from a ridge.
    "We have had [cut] thin sections of the rock made, and we can see [wood] cell structures," Cornuke said.
    Cornuke acknowledges that it may be hard to prove that this object was Noah's ark. But he says he is fairly convinced that the rock formation was an important place of pilgrimage in the past.
    The BASE team has uncovered evidence of an ancient shrine near the outcrop, suggesting that this was an important place to people in the past, Cornuke says.
    "We can't claim to have conclusively found the ark, but it does look like the object that the ancients talked about," Cornuke said.
    Noah and the Flood
    The story of Noah's ark is told in three major world religions: Christianity, Judaism, and Islam.
    The Book of Genesis describes a great flood created by God "to destroy all life under the heavens." But before the flood, God told Noah, one of his human followers, to build an ark and fill it with two of every species on the Earth.

    Once Noah had done this, it rained for 40 days and 40 nights. After 7 months and 17 days the powers receded, according to Genesis, and the ark came to rest on the mountains of Ararat.
    Most Bible scholars have interpreted this to refer to Mount Ararat in eastern Turkey. (See Turkey map.)


    But this location doesn't fit the description given in Genesis of the ark's passengers journeying from the east to arrive at Mesopotamia.
    Cornuke and his team think that Mount Ararat might be a red herring.
    "The Bible gives us a compass direction here, and it is not in the direction of Turkey. Instead it points directly towards Iran," Cornuke said.
    Pilgrim Shrine?
    Using the Book of Genesis and other literary sources, the BASE team journeyed to Iran in July 2005 to climb Mount Suleiman.
    They chose Mount Suleiman after reading the notes of 19th-century British explorer A. H. McMahan.
    In 1894, after climbing Mount Suleiman, McMahan wrote in his journal, "According to some, Noah's ark alighted here after the deluge."
    McMahan also spoke of wood fragments from a shrine at the top of the mountain where unknown people had made pilgrimages to the site.
    "We found a shrine and wood fragments at 15,000 feet [4,570 meters] elevation, as described by McMahan," Cornuke said.
    Subsequent carbon dating of samples from the shrine showed the wood fragments from the site to be around 500 years old.
    Lower on the mountain, expedition members came across the ark-like rock formation, which they estimate to be about 400 feet (122 meters) long.
    Rocks From the Sea?
    Not everyone is convinced by the BASE team's claims.
    Kevin Pickering, a geologist at University College London who specializes in sedimentary rocks, doesn't think that the ark-like rocks are petrified wood.
    "The photos appear to show iron-stained sedimentary rocks, probably thin beds of silicified sandstones and shales, which were most likely laid down in a marine environment a long time ago," he said.
    Pickering thinks that the BASE team may have mistaken the thin layers in the sediment for wood grain and the more prominent layers as beams of wood.
    "The wider layers in the rock are what we call bedding planes," he said.
    "They show fracture patterns that we associate with … the Earth processes that caused the rocks to be uplifted to their present height."
    The boat-shaped structure can also be explained geologically, says retired British geologist Ian West, who has studied Middle Eastern sediments.
    "Iran is famous for its small folds, many of which are the oil traps. Their oval, ark-like shape is classical," he said.
    Meanwhile, ancient timber specialist Martin Bridge, of England's Oxford Dendrochronology Laboratory, is doubtful that a wooden structure would have lasted long enough to petrify under ordinary conditions.
    "Wood will only survive for thousands of years if it is buried in very wet conditions or remains in an extremely arid environment," he said.
    Bible scholars think that Noah built his ark somewhere between 6,000 and 10,000 years ago, making preservation highly unlikely except in extreme environmental conditions.
    And even if the wood had petrified, there seems to be little evidence of Noah's carpentry, according to Robert Spicer, a geologist at England's Open University who specializes in the study of petrification.
    "What needs to be documented in this case are preserved, human-made joints, such as scarf, mortice and tenon, or even just pegged boards. I see none of this in the pictures. It's all very unconvincing," Spicer said.
    Bridge, the Oxford timber specialist, points out that it would also be impossible for a boat to run aground at 13,000 feet. "If you put all the water in the world together, melting both the ice caps and all the glaciers, you still wouldn't reach anywhere near the top of the mountain," he said.
    I think we should be asking why these alleged pieces of petrified wood have not been analyzed in a laboratory and independently verified by archaeologist and geologist who could intelligently discuss the chemical composition and formations in which they were found. Why is Cornuke not publishing papers in journals for peer review and analysis?

    Soapboxmom
    Last edited by Soapboxmom; 09-12-2010 at 08:47 AM.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Raiders of the Faux Ark

    Raiders of the Faux Ark October 10, 2007 by Eric H. Cline
    Biblical archeology is too important to leave to crackpots and ideologues. It's time to fight back.
    This editorial was first published in the Boston Globe on September 30, 2007, and is republished here with their kind permission.


    Eric Cline at Megiddo (Courtesy Eric Cline)
    Noah's Ark. The Ark of the Covenant. The Garden of Eden. Sodom and Gomorrah. The Exodus. The Lost Tomb of Jesus. All have been "found" in the last 10 years, including one within the past six months. The discoverers: a former SWAT team member; an investigator of ghosts, telepathy, and parapsychology; a filmmaker who calls himself "The Naked Archeologist"; and others, none of whom has any professional training in archeology.
    We are living in a time of exciting discoveries in biblical archeology. We are also living in a time of widespread biblical fraud, dubious science, and crackpot theorizing. Some of the highest-profile discoveries of the past several years are shadowed by accusations of forgery, such as the James Ossuary, which may or may not be the burial box of Jesus' brother, as well as other supposed Bible-era findings such as the Jehoash Tablet and a small ivory pomegranate said to be from the time of Solomon. Every year "scientific" expeditions embark to look for Noah's Ark, raising untold amounts of money from gullible believers who eagerly listen to tales spun by sincere amateurs or rapacious con men; it is not always easy to tell the two apart.
    The tools of modern archeology, from magnetometers to precise excavation methods, offer a growing opportunity to illuminate some of the intriguing mysteries surrounding the Bible, one of the foundations of western civilization. Yet the amateurs are taking in the public's money to support ventures that offer little chance of furthering the cause of knowledge. With their grand claims, and all the ensuing attention, they divert the public's attention from the scientific study of the Holy Land - and bring confusion, and even discredit, to biblical archeology.
    Unfortunately, when fantastic claims are made, they largely go unchallenged by academics. There have been some obvious exceptions, such as the recent film "The Lost Tomb of Jesus," which inspired an outcry from scholars by claiming that archeologists had found, but not recognized, the tomb of Jesus more than 20 years ago. But much more common is a vast and echoing silence reminiscent of the early days of the debate over "intelligent design," when biologists were reluctant to respond to the neocreationist challenge. Archeologists, too, are often reluctant to be seen as challenging deeply held religious beliefs. And so the professionals are allowing a PR disaster to slowly unfold: yielding a field of tremendous importance to pseudoscientists, amateur enthusiasts, and irresponsible documentary filmmakers.
    At a time when the world is increasingly divided by religion, both domestically and internationally, and when many people are biblically illiterate, legitimate inquiries into the common origins of religions have never been more important. I believe that the public deserves - and wants - better. We have an obligation to challenge the lies and the hype, to share the real data, so that the public discussion can be an informed one.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    It is time we take back our field.
    The first archeological endeavors in the Holy Land were conducted not by archeologists, but rather by theologians primarily interested in locating places mentioned in the Bible. Pride of place goes to the American minister Edward Robinson, who toured the Holy Land in 1838, accompanied by an American missionary named Eli Smith who was fluent in Arabic, in order to identify as many sites mentioned in the Bible as possible--in other words, to create a historical (and biblical) geography of Palestine. Others soon followed, including Sir Charles Warren, a British general who explored and recorded the features of Jerusalem in the 1860s. None of these men were archeologists, but they made important contributions to the field.
    Throughout much of the nineteenth century, the field of biblical archeology was dominated by men said to have been working with a Bible in one hand and a trowel in the other. The field soon became more scientific, thanks to the efforts of men like Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie, who introduced into archeology the dual concepts of stratigraphy (when two succeeding cities are built one on top of the other, the lower one will always be earlier in time) and pottery seriation (pottery types go in and out of style, just like today's clothes, and can be used to help date the stratigraphic levels observable at ancient sites).
    By the time Dame Kathleen Kenyon was excavating in Jericho and Jerusalem during the mid-twentieth century, archeology was in the hands of professionals trained not just in proper excavation techniques, but in the scientific method, and with years of schooling in ancient languages, cultures, and history. They also mastered bodies of literature and theory and spent years practicing their craft and being subjected to peer review. Theological motivation became less important.


    Excavations at Megiddo
    Today there are strict standards concerning excavations in every country in the Middle East. Permission to excavate must be obtained from the proper authorities, with presentation of a detailed research plan, good reasons given for the questions being examined, evidence of sufficient funding, and often a strategy for conservation of the site upon completion of the excavation. Peer review of any large funding proposals is obligatory. In short, it is a serious and highly competitive field.
    As a result, however, we have seen a rise of two cultures - the scientists and the amateur enthusiasts. Lacking the proper training and credentials, the amateurs are sustained by vanity presses, television, and now the Internet.
    For example, in 2006, Bob Cornuke, a former SWAT team member turned biblical investigator--and now president of the Bible Archaeology Search and Exploration (BASE) Institute in Colorado - led an expedition searching for Noah's Ark. Media reports breathlessly announced that Cornuke's team had discovered boat-shaped rocks at an altitude of 13,000 feet on Mount Suleiman in Iran's Elburz mountain range. Cornuke said the rocks look "uncannily like wood. . . .We have had [cut] thin sections of the rock made, and we can see [wood] cell structures."
    But peer review would have quickly debunked these findings. Kevin Pickering, a geologist at University College London who specializes in sedimentary rocks, said, "The photos appear to show iron-stained sedimentary rocks, probably thin beds of silicified sandstones and shales, which were most likely laid down in a marine environment a long time ago."
    Then there is Michael Sanders, who has made a habit of using NASA satellite photographs to search for biblical locations and objects. From 1998 to 2001, Sanders announced that he had not only located the lost cities of Sodom and Gomorrah, but also the Garden of Eden, the Ark of the Covenant, and the Tower of Babel.
    Sanders describes himself on his website as a "Biblical Scholar of Archaeology, Egyptology and Assyriology," but according to the Los Angeles Times, he "concedes that he has no formal archeological training." Other newspaper accounts describe him as a "self-made scholar" who did research in parapsychology at Duke University.
    And we must not forget documentary filmmaker Simcha Jacobovici. He bills himself as "The Naked Archeologist" in a television series on the History Channel, but has repeatedly stated during media interviews that he is an investigative journalist rather than an archeologist. Jacobovici is perhaps best known for "The Lost Tomb of Jesus," which first aired in March 2007 and which has been described by professor Jodi Magness of the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill as making "a sensationalistic claim without any scientific basis or support."
    In short, the amateur arena is full of deeply flawed junk science. Important issues are cloaked in legitimate-sounding terminology, little attention is paid to the investigative process, and contrary evidence is ignored.
    Biblical archeologists are suddenly finding themselves in a position similar to the evolutionary biologists fighting intelligent design - an entire parallel version of their field is being driven by religious belief, not research principles. The biologists' situation makes the risk clear - they did not deign to mount a public refutation of the "science" of intelligent design for years, until it was almost too late, and thus anti-evolutionary science began making its way into the public schools.
    Why are we sitting the battle out?
    Partly, this is a matter of a strain of snobbery that runs through many academic fields: a suspicion of colleagues who venture too far from "serious" topics or appear in the popular media too often.
    Partly it is a matter of the uncertainty of the stories themselves: many biblical questions are so shrouded in uncertainty as to be inherently unsolvable. For example, even if the Garden of Eden once were a real place, and even if we knew the general location where it might have been, how would we know when we had found it? When most archeologists and biblical scholars hear that someone has (yet again) discovered Noah's Ark, they roll their eyes and get on with their business. This can leave the impression that the report might be true.
    And partly it is because scientific findings may challenge religious dogma. Biblical scholarship is highly charged because the Bible is a religious book and any research carries the prospect of "proving" or "disproving" treasured beliefs. What if the Exodus might not have taken place as described in the Bible? Similarly, what will people do when told that there are identical stories to Noah and the Ark, but they were recorded between 500 and 1,000 years earlier sans Noah? And that the flood was sent because the people were too noisy and the Gods couldn't sleep, not because people were evil and sinning? Or when you tell them that "an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth" was a concept expressed in Hammurabi's Law Code nearly 1,000 years before the Bible?
    This is where it can get daunting for academics, for it is at this point that the ideologues frequently weigh in. And these pundits are often sophisticated and convincing debaters, which can make them intimidating opponents for a scholar.
    But we don't need to go looking for Noah's Ark to find confirmation of details found in the Bible. During the past century or so, archeologists have found the first mention of Israel outside the Bible, in an Egyptian inscription carved by the pharaoh Merneptah in the year 1207 B.C. They have found mentions of Israelite kings, including Omri, Ahab, and Jehu, in neo-Assyrian inscriptions from the early first millennium B.C. And they have found, most recently, a mention of the House of David in an inscription from northern Israel dating to the ninth century B.C. These are conclusive pieces of evidence that these people and places once existed and that at least parts of the Bible are historically accurate. Perhaps none of these is as attention-getting as finding Noah's Ark, but they serve to deepen our understanding of, and appreciation for, the Bible.
    Religious archeologists and secular archeologists frequently work side by side in the Holy Land. Among the top ranks of researchers, there are evangelical Christians, orthodox Jews, and people of many denominations. It is not religious views that are the issue here; it is whether good science is being done. Biblical archeology is a field in which people of good will, and all religions, can join under the banner of the scientific process.
    Most archeological organizations, including the American Schools of Oriental Research, the Archaeological Institute of America, and the Society for American Archaeology, state that it is one of the obligations of professional archeologists to make their findings and discoveries generally available. But we need to do more than simply publish research if we are to successfully counter junk science. We need to take our information to the public not only via writing but also via radio, television, film, and any other available media.
    Remember that biblical mysteries are not just ancient history. For example, did Joshua really fight the Battle of Jericho and drive the Canaanites out of the land, as stated in the biblical account of the Israelite conquest of Canaan? If so, who was there first and to whom does the land really belong today? Does it matter? It does to many Palestinians, who exert a (dubious) claim as descendants of the Canaanites and Jebusites, and to many Israelis, who exert a similar claim based on their own understanding of their ancestors' history.
    Remember, too, that archeologists who speak out can make a difference. "Disclaimer statements" have recently been posted on Bob Cornuke's Web pages concerning the Ark of the Covenant, Noah's Ark, and the location of Mount Sinai. Now, for instance, we find the statement that the BASE Institute "does not make the claim that we have found Noah's Ark. We'll let you draw your own conclusions. In our opinion, it's a candidate. The research continues."
    Even when our own investigations come up empty - we can't solve all the mysteries in the Bible - we can present the current state of our evidence. And we can promote a shared methodology, and a shared body of facts, that can be used by everyone. The data and opinions that we provide may not end any debates, but they will introduce genuine archeological and historical data and considerations into the mix. We owe it to the ancient world, and to the people who inhabited it, to do no less.
    Eric H. Cline is the author of From Eden to Exile: Unraveling Mysteries of the Bible. He is chair of the department of classical and Semitic languages and literature at the George Washington University in Washington, D.C. He is also associate director (USA) of the ongoing excavations at Megiddo (biblical Armageddon) in Israel. He can be reached at ehcline@gwu.edu.
    Cornuke has gotten involved with some very questionable religious groups and spend quite a bit of time roaming the world on very lucrative speaking engagements. I question his true motivation.

    Soapboxmom

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    I think they're looking for a phantom. Not that I don't believe the Bible, I do, (Save it UST, I've said it before too.) but I think the Ark itself would have been 'salvaged' on the spot, at the time, for it's available resources. If you've just come ashore after the complete watery destruction of the planet, there won't be a lot of useable items laying about ready to build yourself a new viable shelter, latrine (You’ve just spent over 40 days and nights cooped up in a stinking boat with who knows how many different critters, do you really ever want to see another turd ever again?) and other necessary whatnot, if you think about that portion of the story in realistic terms. As such, any sort of quest to find the Ark itself is a complete waste of time, believer or not, right?

    "Never judge a man until you’ve walked a mile in his shoes...
    Because then it doesn't matter, you’re a mile away and you have his shoes!"

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    The Ark Of Noah In Iran

    Here is what we found on Mount Suleiman:
    • The object consists of dark rock with an uncanny beam-like appearance in several places.
    • The color and texture of the rock appears to be unique in the area.
    • The object fits the approximate dimensions of Noah's Ark
    • Some samples tested by an independent lab showed signs of petrified wood. (Not the entire object.)
    • The object is at 13,120 feet but the nearest tree is at about 8,000 feet (and there are very few trees even at that level).
    • Takht-i-Suleiman means “Solomon's Throne.” It is the only mountain we know of in the Middle East outside of Israel with a Hebrew name.
    • Wood at the Summit, which may be from the shrine, has been dated to be around 500 years old.
    • We found abundant sea life at an adjacent summit.
    • We found microscopic sea life in a rock sample from the object (a foram, which is normally only found at the depths of the sea).
    • All major climates are close by along with all eco systems.
    I think what Cornuke says right there is extremely telling. The whole object is not petrified wood. Excuse me! Well, what exactly is the composition of the "object." Where are these lab reports showing any petrified wood? What lab did the testing? Just what other things comprise said "object?" Is it basalt rock? Lots of these questions could be answered if the legitimate archaeological and geological researchers and experts were given access to samples so some further professional evaluation could be done.

    Cornuke says:
    Disclaimer Statement
    The research and site survey being investigated by the BASE Institute has strong potential. Is it the remains of Noah's Ark? The BASE Institute does not make the claim that we have found Noah's Ark. We'll let you draw your own conclusions. In our opinion, it's a candidate. The research continues.
    We will be waiting for more research, Bob!!!

    Soapboxmom

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Quote Originally Posted by Soapboxmom
    I think we should be asking why these alleged pieces of petrified wood have not been analyzed in a laboratory and independently verified by archaeologist and geologist who could intelligently discuss the chemical composition and formations in which they were found. Why is Cornuke not publishing papers in journals for peer review and analysis?

    Soapboxmom
    Last edited by Soapboxmom; Today at 09:47 PM.
    Umm,

    I'll give you three guesses as to why not,


    (and the first two don't count)
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    I wonder if Dr. Cornuke is a colleague of Gabriel Burdett ?
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Intelliget Falling equated with --- well, something along the lines of Intelligent Farting. My detailed theory will follow as the research continues!!!!

    Soapboxmom

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
    I think they're looking for a phantom. Not that I don't believe the Bible, I do, (Save it UST, I've said it before too.) but I think the Ark itself would have been 'salvaged' on the spot, at the time, for it's available resources. If you've just come ashore after the complete watery destruction of the planet, there won't be a lot of useable items laying about ready to build yourself a new viable shelter, latrine (You’ve just spent over 40 days and nights cooped up in a stinking boat with who knows how many different critters, do you really ever want to see another turd ever again?) and other necessary whatnot, if you think about that portion of the story in realistic terms. As such, any sort of quest to find the Ark itself is a complete waste of time, believer or not, right?

    Never really gave the time to think about it but I like this scenerio. I don't believe I've ever heard it mentioned on any of the documentaries.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    « Jeffrey Ross Roasts Pamela Anderson | Main | Gribbit's Violent Tendencies »
    Noah's Ark Found - Again

    Category: Creationism
    Posted on: June 17, 2006 10:46 AM, by Ed Brayton
    The folks at Worldview Weekend are busily promoting the latest discovery of Noah's Ark. I say latest because, frankly, the Ark seems to be discovered every few years and yet people keep searching for it. Ron Wyatt claimed to have found it at Durupinar, in Eastern Turkey near Mt. Ararat, but that claim is rejected even by young earth creationist scientists who've visited the site (Wyatt is a first class con artist, or was until he died). Ark searchers have claimed to locate it in Turkey itself, on Mt. Ararat, near Mt. Ararat, in several mountain ranges in Iran and in what was once Urartu. Yet none of them have turned out to be true. But this time, they declare, it's for real:
    Led by explorer, adventurer, and featured Worldview Weekend speaker Dr. Bob Cornuke, a fourteen man crew returned this week from Iran bearing stunning evidence that theirs is the long-anticipated, even coveted discovery of the remains of Noah's Ark. Bob's team consisted of a Who's Who of business, law, and ministry leaders including Barry Rand (former CEO of Avis), the multiple best-selling author and Christian apologist Josh McDowell, Frank Turek (co-author with Norm Giesler of I Don't Have Enough Faith to be an Atheist), Boone Powell (former CEO of Baylor Medical Systems), and Arch Bonnema (president of Joshua Financial).
    Notice what's missing from the list? How about an archaeologist? Or a geologist? The latter would be especially important since, this article claims, the structure they allegedly found looks like basalt:
    Reg Lyle, oil and gas geologist said "the object appears to be a basalt dike, however, it is absolutely uncanny that the object looks like hand hewn timbers, even the grain and color look just like petrified wood....I really need to keep an open-mind about this."
    A basalt dike? That looks like wood grain? A geologist should be able to tell the difference rather easily between a basalt dike and petrified wood. And if he can't, they can certainly be identified in a lab with a basic test - basalt is igneous and should contain all sorts of radioisotopes that petrified wood obviously won't have. But their whole case seems to rest on the alleged appearance of objects that look like wooden beams:
    Bob Cornuke, president of the BASE Institute, is a veteran of nearly 30 expeditions looking for yet-to-be-discovered locations and artifacts described by the Bible. He is cautiously--but enthusiastically--optimistic about the find: "We have no way of confirming for sure that this object is Noah's Ark, but it is probably the most interesting and baffling object ever found by ark searchers...it sure gets my heart to pumping just thinking of what it could be."
    Well you can't prove that it's Noah's Ark, but you certainly can prove whether or not it's made of basalt or whether it's petrified wood. Have they submitted samples to a lab to find out? The article claims that they were tested and found to be petrified wood, but contains no details at all. What tests were performed? At what laboratory? And where are the actual results of that test? Ron Wyatt claimed for years to have lab tests that showed petrified wood from the Durupinar site that dated to about 4500 years ago, but that was a lie.
    Then there's this odd statement from the article:
    Upon being cut open, one of these "rocks" also divulged a marine fissile that could have only originated undersea.
    I presume this means that there was shale inside one of the rocks, or that the rock was made of shale. The phrase "a marine fissile" makes little sense, since fissile is an adjective. Regardless, why the fact that shale originates underwater would have any connection to Noah's Ark is beyond me. The ark, if it existed, floated on the ocean, it didn't get encased in shale at the bottom of the ocean. Of course, the author of the article seems not to understand why one would find marine artifacts in a mountain anyway:
    Scouring the mountains all around the object, team participant Steve Crampton found thousands of fossilized sea shells blanketing the landscape. Cornuke brought back a one-inch thick rock slab choked with fossilized clams.
    No kidding. This would be an example of the typical creationist nonsense that marine fossils in mountain rock proves that there was a global flood; in actuality, it disproves it. If the marine animals were left behind by the flood, they would be on the mountain, not in the mountain. When you find strata on a mountain with marine fossils embedded into it, that means that strata was deposited underwater and then uplifted to its current height much later, a process we can observe happening today.
    Some of America's leading businessmen, an attorney who has argued several cases before the U.S. Supreme Court, and two leading apologists believed the evidence was compelling enough that they made a daring trip to the politically volatile state of Iran and climbed a harsh mountain to see the object firsthand.
    Great. Maybe next time you can send a Dairy Queen manager, a flamenco dancer and two rodeo clowns; their jobs will have just as much relevance to such an exploration as the ones mentioned above.
    Let me add one more thing. The author of the article makes the following declaration:
    This article and the pictures are copyrighted and can not be duplicated in whole or part. You are free to link to this article but you CAN NOT duplicate any portion of the article or any of the pictures without express written permission from Worldview Weekend, Brannon Howse and Bob Cornuke.
    Sorry, Worldview Weekend, it doesn't work that way. There's this little legal thing called Fair Use Doctrine. You can copyright material like this, but you cannot prevent others from quoting it while reviewing or criticizing it. You can read all about it here.
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    How Fossils Form | eHow.com

    It takes thousands of years for fossils to form. It is unlikely those fossils are connected to what is said to possibly be Noah's Ark. Have the alleged fossils been dated?

    Accuracy of Fossils and Dating Methods (ActionBioscience)

    Soapboxmom

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Quote Originally Posted by Whip View Post
    Never really gave the time to think about it but I like this scenerio. I don't believe I've ever heard it mentioned on any of the documentaries.
    Thanks. I don't know if it's been thought of or mentioned before or not really. I thought about it myself, for the first time this morning while reading this post in fact, so it might be the very first time anyone's thought about it, ever! Who knows?
    "Never judge a man until you’ve walked a mile in his shoes...
    Because then it doesn't matter, you’re a mile away and you have his shoes!"

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
    Thanks. I don't know if it's been thought of or mentioned before or not really. I thought about it myself, for the first time this morning while reading this post in fact, so it might be the very first time anyone's thought about it, ever! Who knows?
    I eagerly await the updated documentary with dialogue from 'Anonymous Troll Mike!' and the blackened silhouette with disguised voice.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Quote Originally Posted by Whip View Post
    I eagerly await the updated documentary with dialogue from 'Anonymous Troll Mike!' and the blackened silhouette with disguised voice.
    How do you know I don't look and sound that way already? I'll bet if you asked any of the few remaining YTB faithful, they'd say I likely do.
    "Never judge a man until you’ve walked a mile in his shoes...
    Because then it doesn't matter, you’re a mile away and you have his shoes!"

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Dr. Cornuke got involved with the Advantage Conferences pyramid scam. The rep who took her own life had recommended him as a speaker for November 2007. When she realized how shady of a deal it was and left after being pushed into bankruptcy and financial ruin, she asked me to e-mail Cornuke and alert him to all the court documents and facts so he could decline to speak and not be harmed by being involved with Tim Darnenll and Jack Weinzierl. Cornuke's response was to lie to me and say he needed my real name and contact info for his board. He outed me to Tim Darnell knowing I would be sued and harassed. Cornuke is nothing but an arrogant, pompous blow hard. It looks to me like Christianity for him = $$$$$$.

    Tim Darnell and Catherine / Cathy Starnater Darnell both sent to IRS Hell

    Advantage Conferences Sued the Dallas Better Business Bureau and Lost in Summary Judgment / Tim Darnell / Jack Weinzierl

    Jack Weinzierl Multi-million Dollar Earner or Destitute Ding-a-ling???

    Tim Darnell / Jack Weinzierl / Advantage Conferences and One of the Heroes That Helped Shut Them Down -- Judy S.

    Jack Weinzierl Threatened and Tim Darnell Sued Soapboxmom / Heather Dobrott in District Court & Lost in Summary Judgment

    http://www.realscam.com/f11/tim-darn...starnater-773/

    Jack Weinzierl / Tim Darnell Fabrications of Receiving Death Threats and Being Stalked By Soapboxmom / Heather Dobrott

    Jack Weinzierl is an EVIL Rat! Liar and Scammer! Stephanie Weinzierl of Coram Deo Academy

    Advantage Conferences Implodes into Bankruptcy just as Its Predecessor All Star Entrepreneur / Tim Darnell

    Insurance Agents Held to High Standards / Tim Darnell's Insurance Escapades

    http://www.realscam.com/f16/coram-de...nces-reps-303/

    http://www.realscam.com/f14/tim-darn...backfired-769/

    Jerry Weinzierl / Aaron Weinzierl Religious Scammers Who Threaten Consumer Advocates with Lawsuits Using Google Ads

    Soapboxmom
    Last edited by EagleOne; 01-12-2012 at 07:29 PM.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    I thought I would add some content on the search for Noah's Ark. In 1986-87, I was doing consulting work for Dr. Schuller, the Crystal Cathedral and The Hour of Power, and met Jim Irwin, the astronaut. A friendship developed, and Jim told me he knew where Noah's Ark was located as he had seen it from space. He had gone to do the climb a year earlier, but one of the film crew members got into trouble with the local law, and their permits were pulled the day of the climb, and they couldn't climb. They lost over $1 Million dollars because of that incident.

    He had just received permission to climb again and was putting together his crew to go back and make the discovery. He said the Ark was located on Mt. Ararat in Turkey. One of the problems with the climb was the area you had to start the climb was located on the side closest to the Russian border. Several years earlier in an attempt to climb, they were shot at by the Russian's. The climb was cut short due to an out of season blizzard. Also he said the Russian's were lousy shots, but still you had to be careful. They felt anyone climbing in that area was there to spy on Russia, so they would routinely shoot at people climbing on that side of the mountain, especially people carrying lots of gear.

    So everyone who was part of the team was told they had to know the risk involved, and they could be shot. After several meetings with Jim, I was asked to join the team. We went to the local mountains to practice climbing and to acquaint everyone with climbing in snow and ice. Even though the expedition was to be done in late June/early July of 88, there would still be a lot of snow and ice at the elevation where Jim believed the Ark was located. So we practiced carrying heavy equipment and the special chain saws provided by Stihl needed to cut through the ice to get to the Ark. We trained all winter of 87-88. It was exhausting, tedious, and we even slept in tents on the side of the mountain. While very difficult training it was still some fun a few times.

    Jim left for a meeting with the financier's for the trip, and before he could return back to our camp, he suffered another heart attack, just weeks before we were to leave on the expedition. I saw the pictures he took from space showing where he believed the Ark was located. The satellite images were quite spectacular and convincing the Ark was there. It certainly had the size, shape and look of the Ark. I also spoke with several tribesmen from that region who said as small boys they had stood on the Ark. The area where the Ark is supposed to be located has only been without snow and ice 3 times in the last 90 years. It is under ice and snow 365 days 99% of the time. It was during one of these times when the snow and ice had melted the tribesmen said they had stood on the ark, and some had even been inside a part of it.

    All I know is Jim Irwin and the people from the region believed the Ark was indeed located on Mt. Ararat in Turkey. The pictures I saw appeared to prove this to be true. Only wish we could have gone to find out for sure.

    Some things that resulted from my experience is that: I hate snow, don't like sleeping in a tent, especially in the winter-time when there is a snow storm blowing, and eating MRE's. No I don't do camping either even in the summer. I am glad I had the experience, but never again. It really doesn't matter where Noah's Ark is located. The only thing that matters is that it did exist and it really happened.
    Last edited by EagleOne; 07-18-2014 at 04:23 PM.
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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    I wanted to clarify a point made in my above post about Jim Irwin dying from a heart attack preventing us from going to Mt.Ararat. While he did die from a heart attack, it was not until 1991. I was working from memory, and he did suffer a heart attack which prevented us from going, but the fatal heart attack occured 3 years later. Sorry for any confusion as it was a long time ago and I was reminiscing from memory instead of from my notes. I corrected my mistake in the post above.
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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Eagleone, I find your story of searching for Noah's Ark very interesting. The search for the Ark has never really fascinated me so I have done little reading about it. Your adventure sounds like one for very brave people. Snow storms and tents don't even sound good together!! Must have been exciting and one to remember for a lifetime, probably makes you feel good to think about when you are sitting in front of a good hot fire!

    Thanks for sharing.

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    Re: Dr. Bob Cornuke Crackpot / Noah's Ark Discovered???

    Quote Originally Posted by scratchycat View Post
    Eagleone, I find your story of searching for Noah's Ark very interesting. The search for the Ark has never really fascinated me so I have done little reading about it. Your adventure sounds like one for very brave people. Snow storms and tents don't even sound good together!! Must have been exciting and one to remember for a lifetime, probably makes you feel good to think about when you are sitting in front of a good hot fire!

    Thanks for sharing.
    It is if you remember the facts correctly.

    That will teach me to not write late at night when I am tired, and trying to remember something from 23-24 years ago. But thanks for the kind words.
    EagleOne
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