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Thread: Exposing the Ponzi Masters book released by Real Scam member

  1. #51
    PPBlog is offline Senior Member
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    I read Jim's ebook Wednesday, acquiring it for free through the link here. I think it will serve his intended audience in the Christian community well. The PP Blog was referenced in the publication, but there's no quid pro quo for this comment. I do not know Jim and did not know until the book's publication that the Blog was referenced.

    What struck me about the book was the fear Jim expressed about the safety of his family and his personal safety. There's a passage about a large volume of harassing emails Jim received. He described one as particularly menacing, in part because it referenced his family. As a person who has received similar communications, including one that suggested my family could end up dead because God was displeased by my reporting on HYIP schemes, I know where Jim is coming from.

    I felt for you during that passage, Jim. And your cult reference was spot-on. This menacing behavior is consistent with cult tactics. It also is consistent with the behavior of a racketeering enterprise -- if not from racketeers themselves, then from people who knowingly or unknowingly fall down a racketeering rabbit hole and begin to channel the criminal behavior of their sponsors.

    I'm not sure how familiar Jim is with the AdSurfDaily case, but believe it is particularly instructive on the subject of Profitable Sunrise.

    On the seventh anniversary of the 9/11 terrorist attacks, a purported "prayer" was being circulated among ASD members that called for the prosecution team to be struck dead by the hand of God. (Put another way, "kill the government lawyers and the agents who protect the President of the United States.")


    Here are a few lines from the "prayer" circulating within a purported Christian enterprise (italics/bolding added):

    __________________________________________________ _________

    Pluck them out of their dwelling place!
    Root them out of the land of the living!
    . . .
    Heavenly Father, cause the heavens to bow down with divine judgment! Send your hand from above and rid us of them! Let Truth Prevail!

    Disappoint the devices the enemy has crafted so that their hands cannot perform their enterprise!
    Take them in their own crafty and devious ways!
    Let every attack of retaliation fail!
    Send divine angelic prophetic assaults against all diabolical intelligence!
    Release divine viruses to invade satanic databases and command that they be consumed and destroyed!
    Let all future diabolical communications and networkings fail!
    Send a spirit of confusion amongst them!
    Let their tongues be divided, so that when they communicate it will be incoherent and misunderstood!
    Let all satanic manifestations cease and let divine abortive measures and miscarriages occur in satanic wombs and incubators!

    Heavenly Father, you have given us a great work to accomplish! We war for the releasing of our finances and all resources that belong to us! Let those that hold on to our wealth longer than they should be afflicted and tormented WITHOUT RELIEF until they release what rightfully belongs to us! . . .

    __________________________________________________ _________

    ASD's Andy Bowdoin, of course, described the Secret Service raid as the work of "Satan" and compared the raid to the 9/11 attacks.

    Let's walk this one back and ask a few questions as imponderables: Why would a purported American Christian compare the Secret Service to "Satan" and the 9/11 terrorists? And how could other purported American Christians help advance that thought line and demonize their own country on behalf of an obvious, 1-percent-a-day Ponzi scheme? At a minimum, Bowdoin comparing the Secret Service to the devil and the 9/11 terrorists is a sickening rhetorical flourish -- and yet some American Christians apparently embraced it without giving it an ounce of scrutiny. As noted above, some ASD members rooted for the deaths of government agents and petitioned God to destroy the ASD database that linked them to the scheme.

    It becomes even more incongruous when one considers that some of the ASDers -- after being shown ASD was a Ponzi scheme led by felon who'd laid waste to an earlier group a decade before he targeted Christians again with his 1-percent-a-day scheme -- then gravitated to Profitable Sunrise and its FIVE schemes, all of which promised more than ASD.

    As a graphic points out in Jim's book, Profitable Sunrise published its purportedly "Risk-free Investment Options" literally under the welcoming, outstretched arms of Jesus Christ as depicted in the Christ the Redeemer statue.

    Somewhere in the ASD evidence chain, there is a preraid video of Bowdoin defining himself as a Christian "money magnet" and making repeated references to God from a stage upon which he tried to get prospects to turn over tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars at a time while urging them to imagine even more money "flowing" back to them.

    I'm not sure how many ASDers made their way into Profitable Sunrise and how many of those earlier had prayed to God to kill and torment civil servants and destroy ASD's database, but some of them already had demonstrated the capacity to divorce themselves from reality in the pursuit of preposterous returns and thus would have been useful tools for "Roman Novak."

    One way to look at Profitable Sunrise was as ASD on steroids. Bowdoin offered 1 percent a day; "Novak" nearly tripled that in the "Long Haul" plan, which is easy enough to view as a taunt aimed at the U.S. government. It also might have been a taunt at the Christian community or something designed to test the limits of Christian gullibility. ASD was 1 percent a day; Zeek took that to 1.5 percent a day -- and Profitable Sunrise then began to dangle a 2.7-percent-a-day scheme with ASDers and Zeekers no doubt on board, not to mention the JSSTripler/JustBeenPaid/ProfitClicking MLM Stepfordians.

    North Carolina was still smarting from Zeek (at least $600 million) when it moved against Profitable Sunrise (unknown tens of millions). The state's action immediately was minimized, with the general narrative of the Profitable Sunrise apologists being that it was a small state (or just one state) and that "Barney Fife," a bumbling TV deputy, was in charge of the investigation. This was very close to the ASD narrative, which minimized the Feds' action and bizarrely sought to demonize the prosecution through claims it was led by "Gomer Pyle." Many of you probably have noticed that the TelexFree action in Brazil is being minimized in the same fashion and has at least two other things in common with Profitable Sunrise: the use of the Christ the Redeemer statue as a stage prop and the presence of promoters who'd been in Zeek (at least).

    Another thing TelexFree has in common with Profitable Sunrise is a preposterous ROI. Some affiliates claim that $15,125 sent to TelexFree fetches back $42,075 (or maybe even more) in a year. My guess is that TelexFree, like Profitable Sunrise and ASD before it, has created what effectively are money mules who gather funds from recruits and route it through their own bank accounts. AdViewGlobal, the ASD knockoff scam purportedly operating from Uruguay, also tried to set up things this way.

    The Christian community (and people in general) are at great risk from these insidious scams, which affect personal security and national security. I am glad Jim has chosen to tell the story about what it was like to cover Profitable Sunrise. And although I understand that some people believe that RS is an inappropriate place for an author to market a book, I'd gently encourage my colleagues not to lose sight of the bigger picture.

    When dollars are being stolen by the billions and disappearing down ratholes -- and when "Christians" are praying for God to kill civil servants and comparing the people who guard the Treasury and the President of the United States to "Satan" -- an author trying to promote an antiscam book on an antiscam forum seems like an inconsequential problem.

    PPBlog

  2. #52
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    This is just fantastic information. I would like to do a radio show soon and bring you on to discuss this along with Lynn Edgington. Is PP Patrick Pretty? I assume so. I have great respect for your work sir.

  3. #53
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    I don't know what any of the rest of you think, but I don't think Nancy Jo Frazer has a chance with a jury. She comes off very badly in her general tone in how she testifies and sounds arrogant and guilty. I don't think her pride will let her show any remorse and come out and admit that she was wrong. Her husband and Rosebrock, on the other hand, seem like normal people that I felt sympathetic for after listening to them testify. Maybe it is just me, but that was my reaction to listening to the 2 1/2 hour hearing.

  4. #54
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    If you trying to put a list of most Christian ponzis do not forget wealth4all
    it was very religion oriented.

    JustbeenPaid / Profitclicking - not much a christian theme, but all admins are very religious members of LDS church with links to Sovereign Citizen group
    and almost every christian HYIP-pimp who was in PS/wealth4all/ASD was in it too.

  5. #55
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesParis View Post
    I don't know what any of the rest of you think, but I don't think Nancy Jo Frazer has a chance with a jury. She comes off very badly in her general tone in how she testifies and sounds arrogant and guilty. I don't think her pride will let her show any remorse and come out and admit that she was wrong. Her husband and Rosebrock, on the other hand, seem like normal people that I felt sympathetic for after listening to them testify. Maybe it is just me, but that was my reaction to listening to the 2 1/2 hour hearing.
    James, this case is not criminal, she would not get time here.
    Jury might take in consideration that David lost a job and hurt his reputation and they have 3 children to raise/support.
    Also Nanci has a great talent to pretend that she is just a naive idiot blonde , that might affect jury.

  6. #56
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    I know it is not criminal at this point, but it may become a criminal case. My understanding is that there would also be a jury in this civil case as well.

  7. #57
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    I would love to host a Google Hangout in the next week or two with Lynn, Greg, Patrick, and anyone else that would like to do a round table discussion on Profitable Sunrise. You guys all have a lot of good information to add. If you are unfamiliar with Google Hangouts, you need to set up a Google + account first. The broadcast will include video, so you will need a webcam as well. I think this could be a very interesting start to something positive. I can have up to 8 people on the Hangout in addition to myself as the host. We can go for an hour or so. No script, just free flowing conversation.

  8. #58
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by NikSam View Post
    If you trying to put a list of most Christian ponzis do not forget wealth4all
    it was very religion oriented.

    JustbeenPaid / Profitclicking - not much a christian theme, but all admins are very religious members of LDS church with links to Sovereign Citizen group
    and almost every christian HYIP-pimp who was in PS/wealth4all/ASD was in it too.
    There have been a lot of similar programs and admins and shills for that matter who played the Christian card....
    Dustin Fennel and Faith Sloan come to mind
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  9. #59
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleOne View Post

    As for all the other issues that have been raised, anyone can start a thread and discuss them there, but they really don't belong here. Just my 2-cents worth.
    Amen......
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  10. #60
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by okosh View Post
    There have been a lot of similar programs and admins and shills for that matter who played the Christian card....
    Dustin Fennel and Faith Sloan come to mind
    While not as large dont forget Trevor Reed and the CEP scam that prayed on Christians. Playing the religion card seems to be a common denominator in a big percentage of ponzis. To me, these are the worst of the worst if there is such a thing in scammers. It goes back I think to an effort to reach outside of MMG and Talk Gold ponzi players to suck in new money from non traditional sources. These folks are very unlikely to ever read the ponzi forums or stumble upon Real Scam. Whats great about RS is that many times a simple google search will pull up RS to the top of the page and bingo someone might just find the truth here. Sorry to get off topic here. I despise these ponzi pimps and bible thumpers with every fiber in me.
    If its listed at the Talk Gold ponzi and crime forum its a SCAM.

  11. #61
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesParis View Post
    I would love to host a Google Hangout in the next week or two with Lynn, Greg, Patrick, and anyone else that would like to do a round table discussion on Profitable Sunrise. You guys all have a lot of good information to add. If you are unfamiliar with Google Hangouts, you need to set up a Google + account first. The broadcast will include video, so you will need a webcam as well. I think this could be a very interesting start to something positive. I can have up to 8 people on the Hangout in addition to myself as the host. We can go for an hour or so. No script, just free flowing conversation.
    I'm up for that, anytime from Tuesday-Saturday next week works great for me.

  12. #62
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by NikSam View Post
    If you trying to put a list of most Christian ponzis do not forget wealth4all
    it was very religion oriented.

    JustbeenPaid / Profitclicking - not much a christian theme, but all admins are very religious members of LDS church with links to Sovereign Citizen group
    and almost every christian HYIP-pimp who was in PS/wealth4all/ASD was in it too.
    wealth4all -- or at least one of its "defenders" -- dangled a lawsuit threat against RealScam.com.

    With respect to JSS/JBP/ProfitClicking, the sky was the limit in terms of threats. "Crazy" does not even begin to cover it. Purported operator Frederick Mann clearly is sympathetic to "sovereign citizens" and is the HYIP/cash-gifting equivalent of a polite bank robber. He executes noninvasive robberies so well that some of his marks actually thank him for stealing their money and follow him to the scene of his next heist, so they can be robbed politely again.

    Frederick had a gatekeeper whose job it was to insulate him from criticism/anger displayed by the marks unhappy about getting politely robbed. His rationale for conducting repeated polite robberies (and his means of creating a pool of victims with Christian, conservative or Libertarian leanings) was an explanation that government employees "are much worse than the Mafia" and that "they’re part of a criminal gang of robbers, thieves, murderers, liars, imposters."

    He even speculated that his "program" could be targeted by American "cruise missiles."

    One of his pitchmen ("Brother" Eric Jon Phelps) suggested that people with brown skin should be excluded from the United States because the country was for whites-only and Latinos perhaps best were employed as taco chefs who'd serve white American tourists in Mexico. The same JSS/JBP pitchman ventured that the Pope was secretly running the U.S. IRS from the Vatican in Italy and claimed that “Majority Savage Blacks [in the United States] were never taught to behave in civil White Protestant culture and thus have been released upon us Reformation Bible-believing Whites to further destroy our once White Protestant and Baptist American culture founded upon the Reformation’s AV1611 English Bible and a White Protestant Presbyterian Constitution with its attached White Baptist-Calvinist Bill of Rights.”

    Both Frederick Mann and Phelps might as well have said, "I make money by percolating conspiracy theories and demonizing the Government. My best marks are those who see black helicopters and imagine jack-booted thugs behind every tree. Send your money to me. I'll put it in my magic machine and provide you a yearly return of 730 percent, much more through the miracle of "compounding."

    Here is a partial list of other recent schemes allegedly targeted at people of faith:

    * George Theodule Ponzi scheme in Florida.

    * Trevor Cook Ponzi scheme in Minnesota. (Targeted at conservative Christians and people unhappy with the government and inclined not to trust it. Scheme collapsed in part because pitchman (Bo Beckman) tried to use stolen cash to buy into a National Hockey League franchise. Some of the money was stolen from an elderly couple now in their 90s. Some of the Cook loot was found concealed in walls behind a toilet-paper dispenser. More stash was found in a mall locker. Cook allegedly purchased a "submarine" (submersible watercraft) with some of the stolen cash and planned to use it in Panama. Court-appointed receiver memorably hired a real-estate appraiser who traversed the frozen tundra of Canada on a snowmobile to check on a property Cook bought with stolen money. X number of Christians turned over money to Cook, only to learn later that he was spending their cash on gambling, booze and exotic dancers.)

    * Alleged Steven B. Heinz Ponzi scheme in Utah. (An alleged "loans" component is reminiscent of Profitable Sunrise. Some of the Heinz investors allegedly got paid in cash in supermarket parking lots.)

    * TelexFree in Brazil. (Used Christ the Redeemer statue, like Profitable Sunrise.)

    * “ALL SAINTS CATHOLIC CHURCH LOAN FIRM.” Many derivatives of this. Targeted at Profitable Sunrise victims. Likely a 419 scam targeted at Christians.

    * Alleged Shervin Neman scam in California. Targeted at Persian-Jewish community.

    * Bradley Collins Ponzi scheme in Indiana. (Collins sometimes dressed as a pastor "and told his victims he only worked with God-fearing, church going people and was blessed to be blessing potential investors," the state said.

    * Alleged Ricardo Bonilla Rojas Ponzi scheme in Puerto Rico. (Allegedly targeted at evangelical Christians and factory workers.)

    * Julius C. Blackwelder fraud scheme in Connecticut. (Targeted at Christians.)

    * James Bunchan and Seng Tan pyramid scheme in Massachusetts. (Targeted at Cambodian-Americans. Payment delays were blamed on Hurricane Katrina. After getting caught, Bunchan hatched a murder-for-hire plot and discussed the prospective killings of 12 witnesses and a federal prosecutor. Tan showed up at sales pitches in a "chauffeur-driven Mercedes" and told recruits that the "gods had sent her to make the Cambodian people millionaires too.” This case was similar to Profitable Sunrise in the sense that investors may not even have known who was running the company. Bunchan, born in Cambodia, wanted an "American face" for his companies, "and his neighbor [Christian] Rochon (a Caucasian of Canadian decent) apparently fit the bill,” noted the U.S. Court of Appeals. “And after renting Rochon a suit jacket and taking him to a professional photographer, Bunchan had Rochon’s photo plastered all over the companies’ promotional pamphlets.”

    * 3 Hebrew Boys scam in South Carolina. (Targeted at military and people of faith. Devolved into sovereign citizen sideshow.)

    * Edward L. Moskop fraud scheme in Illinois. (One of the victims was an 85-year-old woman who survived a Nazi labor camp during World War II. The local VFW Post also was targeted. U.S. Attorneys usually don't argue cases in court, instead relying on assistant U.S. Attorneys (AUSAs) to represent the people. But in the Moskop case, U.S. Attorney Stephen R. Wigginton argued part of the case. "Moskop imposed a financial death sentence on many of these victims," Wigginton told the court. The judge put Moskop away for 20 years, the maximum term.)

    * Lauren Baumann Ponzi scheme in California. (Investors were falsely told their money was being used to fund “Christian rock concerts” and to flip real estate at a profit.)

    PPBlog
    Last edited by PPBlog; 10-12-2013 at 01:22 PM.

  13. #63
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Dave Steckel threatens Jim Paris, says Nanci Jo Frazer hired private investigators to go after him. Are these the people that they hired to follow Jim Paris? (Good Friday 2013)

    on BYOAudio

  14. #64
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by JamesParis View Post
    Dave Steckel threatens Jim Paris, says Nanci Jo Frazer hired private investigators to go after him. Are these the people that they hired to follow Jim Paris? (Good Friday 2013)

    **Advertising link removed
    Enough with the advertising Paris....This is the "Profitable Sunrise HYIP" thread not the "Pimp my wares" thread....

    And who cares if some twit hired a private investigator to investigate you months ago??.....
    Get a real threat from a scammer then come back and whine about it to us
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  15. #65
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Another interesting clip from Dave Steckel -

    on BYOAudio

  16. #66
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Dude why dont you be a little kinder to Paris.


    Quote Originally Posted by okosh View Post
    Enough with the advertising Paris....This is the "Profitable Sunrise HYIP" thread not the "Pimp my wares" thread....

    And who cares if some twit hired a private investigator to investigate you months ago??.....
    Get a real threat from a scammer then come back and whine about it to us

  17. #67
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by Former Player View Post
    Dude why dont you be a little kinder to Paris.

    Grizzled veteran syndrome ?

  18. #68
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    LOL! I appreciate the information being provided here by Paris.


    Quote Originally Posted by Nourjan View Post
    Grizzled veteran syndrome ?

  19. #69
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by Former Player View Post
    LOL! I appreciate the information being provided here by Paris.
    Yes on information, no on infomerials! Being threatened or investigated by scammers is nothing new ...!
    It seems like in this "industry" common sense is not all that common!

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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by laidback View Post
    Yes on information, no on infomerials! Being threatened or investigated by scammers is nothing new ...!
    Yes, I remember a particular one that a member on here got!

  21. #71
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    I just got a call from the Bryan Times. They are going to be doing a follow up story with me on Profitable Sunrise and want to discuss my new book.

  22. #72
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    FYI, Bryan Times reporter was not aware of Kansas case against Nancy Jo Frazer. He was also interested in the story that she wrote herself about being found 'innocent' that was posted in this thread. He said he is following this trial and was personally at that hearing.

  23. #73
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by Former Player View Post
    Dude why dont you be a little kinder to Paris.
    Because unlike others I don't give special treatment.....Do a little digging and you'll soon see that Paris is no good....
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  24. #74
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    Re: Exposing the Ponzi Masters book released by Real Scam member

    In the book James claims that after an email he got he decided to carry a gun at all times.....How very Christian of him.....

    So why would someone who claims to be a "black belt practitioner of Tae Kwon Do." need a gun????.....
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  25. #75
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    Re: Profitable Sunrise HYIP - Has anybody dug through it yet?

    And what exactly does he teach at his college for $159????.....

    Keeping in mind the permanent ban in place against such activity by the state of Maine....

    Paris shall not apply for any license in Maine as a broker-dealer, investment adviser, sales representative, agent, or investment adviser representative, nor shall he otherwise act as, or associate with, a securities issuer, broker-dealer, or investment adviser, or otherwise engage, participate, or assist others in the issuance, offer, sale, or purchase of securities in Maine. Further, Paris shall not apply for any license in Maine to sell real estate, insurance, or other investments, nor shall he otherwise act in Maine as a financial planner or as any other financial or investment professional.
    State of Maine and Securities Administrator v. James L. Paris Consent Judgment
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

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