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Thread: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

  1. #1
    laurisb22 is offline Junior Member
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    Angry payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Dear everyone, who is doing business around the world using paypal, using 99designs, or other busines, witch is including online banking.
    I want to inform you about the company payoneer.com witch is issuing MasterCard debit cards, and offering people to use it worldwide.
    But as actual situation stands, underneath this "respectable" company is online scams.
    As i am the one of the many who is in this situation i want to warn everyone about them. At the beginning iv'e registered at this company, so i would be able do my online business in ebay.com and aliexpress.com . As i was recieving 30-35$ per some time, i was sending them to payoneer debit card, and there was no problems at all. At one point i recieved refund 300 $ from aliexpress.com for purchase that i made. And i figured that i won't buy anything, but better off will send it to my card, to buy some tools for my business. Iv'e send the money to payoneer card using paypal as usual for the last 6 months. And here it STARTED, as soon they recieved the money, they put it on PENDING APPROVAL (WTF? My money and they need to approve something? REALLY?) Then, i was writing them, calling them and asking, what is going on, and what is the problem? They pointed my nose in to terms and conditions, and not explaining anything at all. 3 days later when i asked again, what is going on, they did not answer any thing and 3 seconds later i recieved that my transfer is canceled and the money will be send back to sender. LOL. OK. But the money never got back to sender. So iv'e searched internet and found the people who have lost 1400$, another 600$, another 460$. So it appears that this is a system that this company is stealing money. And the person who is waiting for 1400$ havent recieved it for 6 months.
    SO BE AWARE - THIS IS A SCAM, NEVER DO BUSINESS WITH THEM

  2. #2
    laurisb22 is offline Junior Member
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    At the moment there is case opened with MasterCard.Inc, and there is paperwork done, to go to court, and to NyPD, as i am not from U.S. I have turned to embasy of US. And there will be check on this situation with U.S. Internal Affairs. If there is any other people, who have this kind of situation, please contact me. And we will put this scam to an end.
    Thank you

  3. #3
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Hmm, interesting, Payoneer was kicked out from MasterCard authorized providers list, it was on it at least half a year ago i checked.

    PDF: https://www.mastercard.com/us/compan...st-1-15-14.pdf

    Also agree, Payoneer closes their eyes on money laundering , and been involved as enabler for online financial fraud, some big HYIPs were even
    giving debit cards issued by payoneer to investors as some way to establish a credibility.

    If i remember correctly, Payoneer used Choice Bank of Belize as debit underwriter , same bank was used by Vector Card Services in connection to BannersBroker scam. And there was also other type of cards underwritten by some other shady bank.


    (Will post more when i refresh my memory)
    Last edited by NikSam; 02-13-2014 at 08:45 PM.

  4. #4
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Payoneer still gives MasterCards, underwriter of those cards will be different, depends from which jurisdiction you opened account/ requested card / and where it is to be shipped.


    Here is what it shows for me if i try to request a card at the bottom of the page in small print:
    The Card is issued by Wirecard Card Solutions Ltd ("WDCS") pursuant to licence by MasterCard International Inc. WDCS is authorised by the Financial Conduct Authority to conduct electronic money service activities under the Electronic Money Regulations 2011 (registration no. 900051)
    Now, things on legality of that card and if payoneer legally authorized to provide me with that card are still questionable.
    Like,
    * WDCS Card solutions have no right to be money transmitter in my jurisdiction or has any banking license in my country to provide me service, but Payoneer has a MSB registration here.
    * Both Payoneer and WDCS are not on MasterCard vendor list, perhaps there is some other secret party in that deal (or there are 2 Wirecard close-named companies on vendor list, perhaps they are linked)

    How Payoneer picked this configuration to decide whose card i will get ? - beats me,
    WDCS is licensed in UK it says, but not here, perhaps they picking the best solution to minimize legal problems they might face.

    In any case if some of my local regulator would have a problem, Payoneer will deal with that post-factum.
    Regulator more likely will request WDCS to register here too and/or pay a fine or Cease that activity.

    How MasterCard would deal with WDCS and Payoneer if they realize they send cads not being a provider - beats me, perhaps by some other vendor party ? Maybe MC is aware of their setup, also
    people assume that MC would never ever break a law or do something questionable,
    there is a simple fact - MC would be happy if AML laws just disappear, their dream is to make entire world using their cards and not other methods, regardless what it is being paid for, even if it's linked to crime, they just do not want problems with law, but can bend some rules if they do not foresee a legal mess.

  5. #5
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Here is confirmation that Payoneer was kicked out from MasterCard provider list:

    PAYONEER_MC_OUT.jpg

    2013: http://www.mastercard.com/us/company..._Post_List.pdf
    2014: http://www.mastercard.com/us/company...st-1-15-14.pdf
    Last edited by NikSam; 02-15-2014 at 04:30 PM.

  6. #6
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Other debit underwriters Payoneer uses you can see in small print on this page:
    The Payoneer Prepaid MasterCard card is issued by Choice Bank Limited, Wirecard Card Solutions Ltd ("WDCS") (authorized by the Financial Conduct Authority), or First Covenant Bank (member FDIC),
    pursuant to a license by MasterCard® International Incorporated. MasterCard® is a registered trademark of MasterCard International Incorporated.
    URL: Receive & Withdraw | Payoneer®

    As You can see Choice Bank of Belize (the one which was partially involved (as well as i2c and Vector Card Services) in BannersBroker scam is on it.

  7. #7
    Payoneer's Avatar
    Payoneer is offline Payoneer Representative
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Hi Lauris,

    I'm sorry to hear that you are not satisfied with your experience with Payoneer. I have checked your Payoneer account and while I cannot comment on the specific here in an open forum, I can say that a customer support supervisor has sent you an e-mail with additional information.

    Please note that all payments on or pending on your account will be made available to you, either by returning them to sender or by sending them manually to you (via bank transfer or the Payoneer card). As mentioned in the Terms and Conditions for the US Payment Service, we are unfortunately not able to support specific uses of the service, however in the event that we disable an account all funds are made available to the account holder.

    I understand you are upset and I apologize for the inconvenience caused by us no longer being able to provide you with this service. If you have any specific questions related to your account, please don't hesitate to contact me directly at any time: nissimal@payoneer.com
    Nissim
    Head of Community at Payoneer

  8. #8
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Lauris, please explain what was an issue in details and how Payoneer solved it (when they do), do not let them shut your mouth with your own money.
    Also explain what kind of business you do and how is that against Payoneer T&C and "US Payment Service".

    Your feedback will be helpful for others who are in the same situation.

  9. #9
    laurisb22 is offline Junior Member
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by Payoneer View Post
    Hi Lauris,

    I'm sorry to hear that you are not satisfied with your experience with Payoneer. I have checked your Payoneer account and while I cannot comment on the specific here in an open forum, I can say that a customer support supervisor has sent you an e-mail with additional information.

    Please note that all payments on or pending on your account will be made available to you, either by returning them to sender or by sending them manually to you (via bank transfer or the Payoneer card). As mentioned in the Terms and Conditions for the US Payment Service, we are unfortunately not able to support specific uses of the service, however in the event that we disable an account all funds are made available to the account holder.

    I understand you are upset and I apologize for the inconvenience caused by us no longer being able to provide you with this service. If you have any specific questions related to your account, please don't hesitate to contact me directly at any time: nissimal@payoneer.com
    YEs yes Nasim, i am hearing this kind of things all the time. We appriciate, we will help. Please contact... that does not help.
    Yes i recieved an e-mail from your company. And guess what :)

    COPY OF MAIL:

    Dear Lauris,

    Thank you for your feedback.

    After careful consideration, Payoneer has chosen to no longer provide the US Payment Service for your card ending in 2528. While we appreciate your frustration related to our company's recent decision not to support the service for you, and the subsequent inconvenience it caused you, according to the US Payment Service's Terms and Conditions you are supposed to receive funds only for business related activities approved by us. In accordance with the electronic agreement you agreed to upon the service application, it is within our company's authority to reevaluate, change, or cancel an existing arrangement we have with account holders.

    Lauris please do not view this situation as a personal attack against you by Payoneer. If you believe there was an error, please send us a detailed e-mail with all relevant information in order to bring it to our attention.

    In addition, this is to confirm that PMT 9342594, $300, has been declined and you should see the full amount refund on your PayPal account shortly.

    We hope you understand our position in this matter, and we will do everything we can to ensure we provide you with only the best financial and customer support services.

    Best regards,

    Dan

    Payoneer Customer Support Supervisor

  10. #10
    laurisb22 is offline Junior Member
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by NikSam View Post
    Lauris, please explain what was an issue in details and how Payoneer solved it (when they do), do not let them shut your mouth with your own money.
    Also explain what kind of business you do and how is that against Payoneer T&C and "US Payment Service".

    Your feedback will be helpful for others who are in the same situation.
    The situation with me is real simple. As i am doing small busines over ebay.com and a bit in aliexpress.com i am using paypal.com as my partner. I am selling board games (my own crafted). And as i decided not to buy materials over internet, but directly from shop in my country. I registered for a bank card @ payoneer.com as seemed helpfull. So and as i had a transfer to paypal i was forwarding it to payoneer.com and recieving it in ATM. So it was ok with me. But the amounts of it was small. 30-40%.
    Now 1.5 years later i recieved an refund from aliexpress.com about one order with dispute case. So ive decided to send it to payoneer.com and put that money in to my business. The amount is 300$
    So as soon they got the transfer from Paypal.com they put the money in to pending position. So i've started to chat with them and calling them to find out, what it is, and for how long. No normal explanation were recieved. So After few calls and realy offen (about 5 a day) online chats. They send me the e-mail. To send print screens from my pay pal. I did.
    After what i did not recieve any other information. Apart i started to google this company. And fount few people whom lost money just in this way. Thay waited realy long, and after what their transfer was canceled. And money was not returned.
    °So i've started to get a bit suspisious and where contacting this company every few hours for update. And at one moment i recieved and transfer canceled. And money is being send back! :D For no actual reason or explanation! :D So and now here i am! :)

  11. #11
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Ok, as i understand, Lauris is using a service from Payoneer called "US Payment Service" which basically provides you a virtual US bank account, which you can link to PayPal
    and according to this service FAQ, you can use the service for one way transfers PayPal -> Payoneer


    PAYONEER_PAYPAL.jpg
    USP Service - FAQ | Payoneer


    So in email to Lauris Payoneer states "according to the US Payment Service's Terms and Conditions you are supposed to receive funds only for business related activities approved by us."
    I do not see any Specific "US Payment Service's Terms and Conditions" on Payoneer site before or during opening an account and definitely do not see anywhere such statement, and FAQ page does not mention it. If you really had access to such documented terms and it stated there and you were asked to agree to it before you started using the service - you should have requested approval from Payoneer for you Paypal business use. If not than Payoneer is at fault. But Payoneer also in FAQ states that use of USPS will be approved first before you will be able to use it at all.
    If they initially approved you and you were even using it to transfer money out of PayPal, they cannot claim now that they did not.

    In any case Payoneer must return your money as soon as possible if they decided not to have you any longer as a client.
    If they do not fix the situation in 7 days, please submit claim on them to BBB (Consumer Complaints for Payoneer, Inc. - BBB serving Metropolitan New York, Long Island, and the Mid-Hudson Region)
    under "Billing/Collection Issues"

    @Payoneer Representative
    I do not know how the hell you do business in Israel, and do not really care, But if you want to keep your MSB registration with NY state and with FinCEN, you better stop screwing around.
    Last edited by NikSam; 02-17-2014 at 10:15 AM.

  12. #12
    Payoneer's Avatar
    Payoneer is offline Payoneer Representative
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Payoneer is a fully regulated US company and MSB, operating in accordance with all applicable online payment regulations. It is extremely rare for us to disable an account, however in the event that we do so, all funds will be made available to the account holder.

    When signing up for a Payoneer account, or when signing up for the US Payment Service, you are requested to upload a copy of a photo ID and also submit an online questionnaire. You are also required to agree to the Terms and Conditions for the US Payment Service, which is available here: https://pubs.payoneer.com/files/tc/T...entService.pdf

    The US Payment Service is a solution to receive funds for business related purposes. We are unfortunately not able to support the personal transfer of funds. A full list of prohibited uses of the service is available in the Terms and Conditions, under section 5. This is also referred to in any e-mail correspondences sent by our US Payment Service Department.

    I do very much apologize for any confusion or inconvenience, and assure you that under no circumstance will Payoneer retain funds and not make them available to the account holder.
    Nissim
    Head of Community at Payoneer

  13. #13
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Glad to see you are cleaning up your act.
    Would also recommend you to explicitly add to the list of forbidden use:
    * Sale of unregistered securities / investments.
    * HYIP, passive income, work-at-home and get-rich-quick schemes.
    * MLM, network marketing, pyramid–selling schemes.

    And you should also investigate when a person or some "company" is requesting a bulk of Master cards
    as they claim for their "employees", if such company is offering investments somewhere online.
    Last edited by NikSam; 06-05-2014 at 12:30 PM.

  14. #14
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Still, as of May 30th , Payoneer is not back on the MasterCard's list of compliant vendors.

  15. #15
    Char's Avatar
    Char is offline Senior Scambuster
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Niksam,

    Thought you might be interested that Payoneer appears the be issuing the MasterCard for Flexkom.

  16. #16
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    It is not the first they been a supplier of debit cards to criminal organizations, primary - investment fraudsters and money laundering outfits.
    If not them someone else would, while there are Choice Bank of Belize who is underwriter of those cards and few other drug cartel banks.

  17. #17
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    @Payoneer Representative

    Can you please clarify what type of service FlexKom has with you and provide "Terms and Conditions" reference for such service.

  18. #18
    NOTassmokey is offline Junior Member
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    I received my Payoneer last month and I loaded few days ago using OKPay. With a mere $80.
    First they took their annual fee THEN locked the card claiming that the source of the funds is unknown asking for documents to prove the purchase.
    After providing screenshots of my OKPay account and the actual credit card withdrawal transaction, they replied, quoting their staff "I understand the funds are coming from OKPay.com, however this company is a payment company, and the funds didn't originate at OKPay, but came from a third party."
    Still haven't unlocked my card, I submitted screenshots of my Payza and Paypal of all my transactions. I have no freaking idea what they want, a 100% legit company would have taken their fee AFTER the verification of the source.

  19. #19
    Whip's Avatar
    Whip is offline Anonymous. As are you all
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by NOTassmokey View Post
    a 100% legit company would have taken their fee AFTER the verification of the source.
    exactly. They should have never accepted your money if it really was an issue. They are just as bad as the ones they claim they suspect.

  20. #20
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by NOTassmokey View Post
    ...

    "I understand the funds are coming from OKPay.com, however this company is a payment company, and the funds didn't originate at OKPay, but came from a third party."
    ...
    Funny that they understood that but not that OKpay is operating illegally (unlicensed / unregistered / "everything goes" / russian outfit ran by you know who :)


    @Representative

    care to explain how accepting transfers with OKPay fits in your Anti Money Laundering framework :)
    Last edited by NikSam; 06-28-2014 at 11:32 AM.

  21. #21
    NOTassmokey is offline Junior Member
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Quote Originally Posted by NikSam View Post
    Funny that they understood that but not that OKpay is operating illegally (unlicensed / unregistered / "everything goes" / russian outfit ran by you know who :)


    @Representative

    care to explain how accepting transfers with OKPay fits in your Anti Money Laundering framework :)
    I don't know anything about OKPay. I was sold a bad item then refunded by a user though, usually that's enough.

    However, if it's such a problem the transaction should have been denied/refunded/reported whatever, not accepted and the fee taken.

  22. #22
    Payoneer's Avatar
    Payoneer is offline Payoneer Representative
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Payoneer is required to verify the source of all payments received using our service. Companies such as OKPay, who do not have an official agreement and integration with Payoneer, issue refund transactions to prepaid debit cards. This utilizes the merchant payment system, basically doing the opposite of charging a card.

    Such a refund transaction is generally used to return funds or refund a purchase that was also originally made with the same card. In this case, a refund is being made while no original transaction actually exists on the Payoneer card. Payoneer, along with other online payment solutions, are not able to support such services.
    Nissim
    Head of Community at Payoneer

  23. #23
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    Are you aware, that OKPay is not licensed as either MSB or any financial institution anywhere in the world. ? And in fact is deemed as unlicensed in every jurisdiction ?
    Are you aware that OKPay is openly processing payments for Ponzi schemes and other cybercrime ?

    Do I need to point out what happened to all financial institutions who dared to link themselves to Liberty Reserve ?


    I would also appreciate if you answer my previous question about FlexKom scheme, a client of yours.
    Last edited by NikSam; 08-19-2014 at 05:20 PM.

  24. #24
    covs67 is offline Junior Member
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    I hope i won't get these kind of issues with my newly issued Payoneer debit card. I never knew Payoneer has a bad reputation online.

  25. #25
    NikSam is offline AntiCon Artist
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    Re: payoneer.com - WorldWide Scam

    @Payoneer Rep,

    Glad to see that you acted against Unetenet ponzi scheme, I hope our RS forum was the reason you banned it.


    Maybe we should open a thread on unetnet as it is now a hot topic and have problems with Latvian authorities and bank accounts are frozen.
    Also I see few serial ponzi recruiters (well known here) are now pimping this scam.

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