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Thread: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

  1. #26
    baylee is offline Senior Scambuster
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    This is what I have found so far (Is all shareholders considered owners in this no corporate?)

    What is corporate and non-corporate form of business?
    Answer:
    A corporation is an artificial person, legally independent of its owners and/or operators. The owners of a corporation are its shareholders.

    A business that is not a corporation legally is just its owners and operators, usually in the form of a sole proprietorship or a partnership.

    If someone sues a corporation that is as far as it can go, they cannot sue either the owners or operators.

    If someone sues a business that is not a corporation they are automatically suing all the owners and operators.

    Link:

    What is corporate and non-corporate form of business

  2. #27
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobrainer View Post
    The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty
    ~Winston Churchill
    A wise man proportions his belief to the evidence ~ David Hume

    Technology making foundational changes to society and how we function in it I can believe, I'd be a fool not to. But to think a few chuckle heads making absurd promises as a prelude to asking for 30 odd dollar donations are going to out compete multi billion dollar corporations in a fluid and evolving marketplace,... not so much.

    Imagine GBBG can accomplish (and demonstrate) just 10% of what they promise on a technological level, what is going to stop the combined resources of each and every technology company, research university and government on the planet from catching their wave and riding farther and faster than GBBG can do alone? The Wright brothers created the first heavier than air powered aircraft but played only a small role in the evolution of the airplane past it's infancy. The efforts of thousands of people in hundreds of separate companies in many different countries were able to develop the concept far faster than the Wright brothers could have alone. This is basically how all innovation works, Tim Berners-Lee is credited with inventing the first graphical web browser but if he's making any money off of FireFox, Opera or any of the others it's because he bought stock.

    Now let's move on to the claim that GBBG will "virtually eliminate the need for the entire global banking system," well now don't you think the entire global banking system might have a little something to say about that? Bitcoin is an fascinating concept and it will be interesting to see how it will develop but it will never replace the Federal Reserve banking system or the central banks in every other nation. If Bitcoin ever makes a significant economic impact it will fall under regulation, a nearly anonymous exchange medium would be a dream come true for drug cartels and terror groups, not to mention run of the mill criminals. Do you honestly believe that every government on the planet will sit on their hands while control of their money supply slips through their fingers?

    This is an anti scam forum and one necessary skill I would wish it could teach is for people to separate their enthusiasm for "too good to be true" from the more grubby reality of how something actually functions. We've seen all manner of pie in the sky promises, Hell BitBillions reminds me of nothing so much as Robert Kuntz's "BuzzBot" scam of a few years back (Google him if interested). The key is to place all the promises into a small mental box and focus on how they are selling that box to you. For instance, when Larry Page and Sergey Brin went off looking for the first round of funding for the company that became Google they did not use a three by seven matrix in their repayment plan. And I'm pretty sure they didn't send people to notorious ponzi pimp forums like TalkGold and MMG to scare up new investors. No, the kind of programs with dodgy matrix deals which are of interest to the pimp forum followers are the illegal get rich quick games where 85 to 90% of the people who invest lose their money.

    Let's assume for a moment (and just for a moment) that GBBG is an idealistic and well intentioned endeavor. If so they are being almost incalculably stupid in how they are marketing themselves. True they don't have many truly good options in the corner they've painted themselves into but if they intended to or not they've made themselves catnip to the ponzi pimps. If this wasn't their intent they need to scrap their current investor model and distance themselves from the get rich quick crowd. As it is they're being laughed at by technically minded forums and lapped up by the serial con game promoters. Time will tell but I'm confident that it's a story we've all heard here before.
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  3. #28
    Whip's Avatar
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    This sounds just like those that pimped that liberty dollar or whatever it was scam.

  4. #29
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Whip View Post
    This sounds just like those that pimped that liberty dollar or whatever it was scam.
    Again, it's important to separate Bitcoin from BitBillions. A bitcoin has a value because people are will to pay something for them, it is an interesting idea which does have some valid utility to it. Wordpress for example will accept them as payment for their fees from countries were other payment systems don't work. But all that is at best a side issue to the topic at hand, which is closer to whether or not Bit Billions and GBBG will turn the entire world upside down and make it's investors rich beyond the dreams of avarice or are they (yet another) grubby little scam.
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  5. #30
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobrainer View Post
    I could not have said it better! Individuals who call programs "scam" before ever doing any research or understanding a new concept really don't hold any clout when its comes to credibility on the issue, but I suspect its those individuals who are rather trying to get some sort of "response" or "draw attention" to a particular issue. After looking at many profiles and seeing their past posts its very clear that they just call everything a "Scam" probably because they lack vision or insight or most likely only have a few braincells.

    If only they took the time to understand what's coming.........
    I have not called it a scam, all I had presented here is what I located online by researching bitbillions. So you look at profiles and see what some are doing and make a snap judgment as to who has any brain cells or not. Well, you have your opinion and I have mine. You will not read anything in here that I posted as stating WHAT bitbillions is - I have asked a question if the 'bits' were connected as they are using the names on the the ads together. There should be nothing wrong with doing research on something that seems suspicious. After all this is RealScam, you decide...
    Don't get ripped off!! Stay informed!

  6. #31
    GlimDropper's Avatar
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Stripping away the hype and all the mangled technobable we can safely return to the original objection. Bit Billions is IN FACT at least in part, a stupid little pyramid scheme. If it ever becomes more than that only time will tell but you can, as we speak earn money (bitcoin) just from convincing other people to donate to Bit Billions after signing up with your affiliate link.

    Rewards Paid Instantly


    GBBG INSTANTLY rewards members for each referral’s accepted membership application. Each member has a Referral Identification Number. They can share this number with friends and relatives to earn INSTANT MONEY!


    If you are a member of GBBG, you can MAKE MONEY INSTANTLY by telling your friends and others about GBBG. The very instant one of your referrals becomes a member, we will send you a payment! The amount of each payment is determined by an algorithm designed to maximize compensation for each member.


    NOTE: All payments are made in bitcoins. You must have a Bitcoin wallet or e-wallet to receive payments. Please be advised all regional taxes are your responsibility. Bitcoin provides an anonymous monetary solution, however GBBG strongly advise you to adhere to the laws of your jurisdiction, especially in relation to compensation.
    [Link]

    Please note that before any "one of your referrals becomes a member" they need to donate a minimum of one bitcoin. At about the 18:30 mark in this video the host is showing a screen from his BitBillions back office showing his affiliate earnings. They run from about .17 to .23 bitcoin per signup, no explanation is given for this variation but at today's price that would amount to about $5.83 to $7.89 per person enrolled. The same video mentions that it will be several months before GBBG even pretends to have goods or services to market to the public. Let's see:

    • Someone must pay (donate) to join an opportunity to earn by
    • Recruiting other people to pay (donate) to join the opportunity and
    • The receipt of goods or services is not the primary motive for any payments made.


    Textbook example of a pyramid scheme and all proven by the Bit Billions website and a video of their back office.

    Sorry Nobrainer, for what ever else this might be or might someday become today BitBillions is a naked pyramid scam. Which quite conveniently explains why GBBG's primary support is coming not from legitimate Bitcoin or technology enthusiasts, but rather from the people who play illegal money games in hopes of making fast easy money.

    And a late edit to add this nugget from their website:

    The GBBG software will be 100% cloud based through a peer-to-peer structure. Every computer or device used by a member serves as a 'host' or a central 'processor'. No one person or limited group of persons can control, manipulate, or affect GBBG because the management, processing, storage and retrieval of all data is conducted by the collective organization of member computers and devices.
    Now I presume that at this time no GBBG software is currently being distributed which is good, because otherwise I'd suspect they'd be using members computers clock cycles to help mine bitcoin.

    And btw, all the talk about the anonymity of the cloud and how no one will ever be able to know how much money is made by who or where might sell well to the ponzi pimps but just for a moment try to hear the same sales pitch with the ears of the IRS or any similarly situated entity.

    Yea, this will go over well. LOL
    Last edited by GlimDropper; 03-04-2013 at 08:25 PM.
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  7. #32
    aussie_striker is offline Senior Member
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Ok, it's only fair since I am being talked about on here that I respond.

    Most of the comments on here are similar to those on the bitcoin forum. The first response that was mention on this thread does not take into account the post I made was made after doing what the same person told me I could do.

    Ok, down to business. I know what a ponzi is, in fact I will often tell others they are in one. I tell it how it is and if I think it is a ponzi I will say so. Still I can understand why some people would think it might be one. However the speed that people are labeling it one astounds me. Why is it that this program states on its website where it will earn revenue when it releases the products (in multiple industries). Yet other programs that either do not say what they are going to launch, or base it on something that is obviously rubbish like they are going to make profits through trading (often tried by hyips). Then there are the ones that keep getting members to 'reinvest' commissions into cyclers, or advertising on their site or some other crap that just perpetuates the illusion of increasing their wealth without ever having to payout on much of it at all.

    I have seen it all.

    So why is GBBG any different?
    Their claims may seem unrealistic but who is to say. They talk about building something using peer to peer and cloud technology. Now this is not new however it is a developing technology that really has not been utilised to its fullest yet. There is certainly opportunity there to make something. Could that something become big enough to revolutionise the way we do things online? Well Facebook did! Who knows to be honest. Maybe they have overstated their claims in the hope to get fast growth. That does not mean they will not achieve any, some or even all of those claims.

    As to the compensation...
    As mentioned in pre-launch GBBG are taking donations and maintaining a 1 BTC donation gives people a Founder Position. Anything under 1 BTC is giving them a reserved position. This is not unusual to have a prelaunch, nor is it unusual to pay referral commissions based on initial funds going to the company. Now if that was all that GBBG ever did, they could be called a Ponzi. Until it is proven they are not developing any technology, software, or any revenue sources that are going to be used for the revenue share, then you cannot call them one. So far they have delivered what has been promised to this point.

    Why the Compensation Plan proves this will not be a Ponzi.
    I have looked closely at the compensation plan and this has to be one of the most legit plans you will ever see. There are no weekly,monthly, even yearly fees. The only thing mentioned is that for those that want to take part in the compensation they will be required to make a yearly donation. Note that this donation does not have a minimum of 1 BTC only the original Founder positions do. Also the first 10,000 positions will not have to donate yearly to take part in the revenue share.

    Most ponzis offer great rewards and to earn them you are either paying monthly and/or doing something for it. Or there are the cyclers that you have to keep getting new people in till the point they just fail. This has nothing like that. It is very simple. Every qualified member will earn revenue share. For those that get positions early, they will have the benefit of taking part in multiple pools based on a % of revenue. Note: revenue from income streams that are not yet on the site. This is not based on revenue from donations from new people.
    The part that many look at and scream pyramid or ponzy is the matrix. But I bet most of those people do not even know how it works. It is not a typical matrix like you see on many other sites. 99% of the others require the monthly payment, or sales and you earn a % based on your downline money generated. You can earn from this matrix without a single person on it spending a cent!
    I dare you to show me another one where that is possible.'

    Here is how the matrix works.
    In addition to the Monthly Revenue Pool Sharing, we pay you a bonus of 7% of the EARNINGS of each person below you in the matrix, down 7 levels!
    You DO NOT have to pay a monthly fee or buy anything! All you have to do is earn points for using our FREE services and you will earn 7% bonus on the EARNINGS of every member below you in the matrix, down 7 levels!
    The most important word there is earnings. You earn a % based on revenue share that they have earned. There is no other program that I have ever seen that does this. It is very clever as if you do the maths you will find that they end up paying close to 75% of revenue out to members in total. This is another significant figure as it proves that the company can be sustainable. They only pay from revenue so as revenue grows, so will the amount shared, but so will the money GBBG make. Unlike Ponzis where you cannot mathematically make it work because the money being 'earned' by members exceeds what comes in. The answer they have for that is to have more membership fees and regular ones.

    Commissions

    Another difference is that commissions are sent directly to your bitcoin wallet. You do not have to make a withdrawal request then hope they will send it. This should be a comfort to many who have thought they had a lot of money in a program, only to find they were unable to withdraw any of it as the program scammed them

    This program and the compensation are unlike any program that is currently online. So many people look at a picture of a matrix and immediately claim to know what it is all about. Well maybe some other programs you would be right but this one is different.

    Will they Succeed?
    As with anything time will tell. I know that if they do I would want to be one of the people that had faith in it early and made the most of it. If they don't, well nothing ventured nothing gained, however it will not be because they scammed anyone. It would be a failure from lack of support for the software which we haven't seen yet.

    Due diligence is wise and I blame nobody for sitting on the sidelines while this develops but I do think those that jnump in and label it as a scam are thinking very shallow. There are plenty of scams out there, this is not one of them.

  8. #33
    ribshaw's Avatar
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Aussie, I am sure others with a better understanding of the online world will have a better set of questions, but a few come up on my end.

    1. What on earth is a bitcoin, bitty bitty or whatever it is called, and why should I need them? For instance, I frequently shop Amazon, Ebay via Pay Pal, recently booked two trips on a travel site, all with my credit card. That card is linked electronically to my bank account, so I can wire them payment at the end of the month. No muss, no fuss. Why would I switch?

    2. It seems to me, and forgive my ignorance if I am missing something that the whole gist of the pitch is that I recruit people and make money. Fair enough, but if this is a change the world technology why would people not just use in the same fashion they use Google or Facebook?

    3. As for the investment, it seems recruiting driven which to me always throws up a red flag. Not just that it is a scam, but overly complex. Why on earth are you not seeking venture capital funding or if you don't want to give up ownership the way some VCs may want, why not seek a few investors who are large in size? Just seems to me a 7x7 matrix with a bunch of folks throwing in $50 and getting their friends to throw in the same is overly complex and costly. I also question if it is profitable as a business strategy as it costs money to do accounting and printing 1099s or similar for all these investors.

    Thank you.

  9. #34
    littleroundman is offline Administrator
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by ribshaw
    It seems to me, and forgive my ignorance if I am missing something that the whole gist of the pitch is that I recruit people and make money.
    Ponzi, pyramid, endless chain recruiting scheme, unlicensed public offering, fraud, mailfraud, conspiracy ???

    Who the h*** cares ???

    It's being promoted as a get-rich-quick scheme by anonymous posters on ALL the usual suspect HYIP ponzi forums AND is all froth and bubble theory.

    There's no damned product.

    Desperadoes only, at this stage, I'm afraid.

    (BTW, outside of the HYIP ponzi/pyramid scene, who the heck has ever heard of a "prelaunch" anyway ??)
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  10. #35
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    I have no idea, before I found this site I always followed the old school scams with a degree of interest. Some of this new nonsense is barely understandable. After 300 pages of BB I still have no idea how affiliates are supposed to make money. (Other than recruiting) And now BitCoins, one of the firsts things I found on Google was someone had their BitWallet hacked for 250,000 bit coins, oh the injustice.

    But I am willing to learn and see what Aussie Two up has to say.

  11. #36
    okosh's Avatar
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by aussie_striker View Post
    Ok, it's only fair since I am being talked about on here that I respond.
    G'day David and welcome to RealScam....Nice to have a "Newman" with your experience here

    Since reff links and promotion is not welcome here allow me to direct people to your site so they can see more about what you promote....
    Network Money Makers | Network Money Makers

    You do seem to have a better understanding then most about bitcoin so I hope you will stick around and help others to better understand it....

    Personally I don't see bitcoin as "scam"....I do see many problems with the set up like if you loose your password to your account then you've lost your coins as there is no way to recover it....
    Could all be a ponzi just like Altergold was but IMHO it's a little early to tell....
    For the record I do not and will not use bitcoin....

    Bitbillions IMO is just a way that someone found to run a HYIP that uses bitcoins as it's currency....

    Just one off topic questions if I may....
    David you were big into Zeek.....Has the receiver contacted you at all regarding clawbacks??....
    Just asking cos I want to know if anyone outside the USA was contacted.....

    Thanks....And again, welcome to realscam
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  12. #37
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobrainer View Post
    Useless currency? Bitcoin value has gone from $4.75 BTC in early 2012 to nearly $36 BTC todays price so how can it be useless?
    The simple answer is that it's so anonymous that it could vanish any day and then what would it be worth??....
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  13. #38
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by path2prosperity View Post
    Thanks for pointing that out Nobrainer and GlimDropper. There was a TG member who followed the bitcoin saga and made some very astute comments. If you want the name of the person concerned and links where the person posts, please let me know.
    You mean Shane of nanaimogold or TD??....
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  14. #39
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by okosh View Post
    You mean Shane of nanaimogold or TD??....
    Sent you e-mail

  15. #40
    JustTooMuchTime is offline Senior Scambuster
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by aussie_striker View Post

    Why the Compensation Plan proves this will not be a Ponzi.
    I have looked closely at the compensation plan and this has to be one of the most legit plans you will ever see.
    What does that even mean? And what is this magical "GBBG Confidentiality Enforcement Tribunal" mentioned on the Join Now/#NDA page.

    I've heard of arbitrating NDA's and mediating NDA's and going to court over NDA's, but I've never heard of the Magical Tribunal System Of Dispute Resolution.

    Anybody who would agree to this contract is out of their mind.

  16. #41
    baylee is offline Senior Scambuster
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    I am still trying to sort through this so I am not ready to declare this a scam but there is a huge RED FLAG right from the very beginning before going deeper into it. It is being pimped on the Ponzi Forums. That is strike one right there.

  17. #42
    aussie_striker is offline Senior Member
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    A lot to reply to.

    Quote Originally Posted by baylee View Post
    I am still trying to sort through this so I am not ready to declare this a scam but there is a huge RED FLAG right from the very beginning before going deeper into it. It is being pimped on the Ponzi Forums. That is strike one right there.
    I think that is because the people that have been the ones early in do not know other places to promote something like this. By all means let me know of any good places to promote opportunities to people.

    Originally Posted by Nobrainer View Post
    Useless currency? Bitcoin value has gone from $4.75 BTC in early 2012 to nearly $36 BTC todays price so how can it be useless?
    The simple answer is that it's so anonymous that it could vanish any day and then what would it be worth??....
    Well it isnt staying so anonymous. It is up to $47 today. That means the donation will also be higher to take part in Bitbillions I expect. There is a lot of positive press for bitcoin and I admit I am not up with all of it but I reckon the people that got it on the cheap are laughing all the way to the bank now.

    I do see many problems with the set up like if you loose your password to your account then you've lost your coins as there is no way to recover it....
    Bitbillions IMO is just a way that someone found to run a HYIP that uses bitcoins as it's currency....
    Yes the password issue is a strange one, not sure about that one. HYIP is the totally wrong description here as it is not high paying, nor is it an investment program. HYIPs are very high risk, in fact I would say 99% of them are scams. They will offer a % return over a set period of time. Bitbillions does none of those things so the description is totally wrong. There are those sort of programs using bitcoins already. In fact there is a pretty big bitcoin community which is relatively unknown.

    David you were big into Zeek.....Has the receiver contacted you at all regarding clawbacks??....
    Just asking cos I want to know if anyone outside the USA was contacted.....
    I was in Zeek yes, I wouldn't say big into it, I was certainly not one of the big players. I probably profited about $1000 over the whole time, so the receivers are probably not interested in such a small amount. There are plenty of people that made tens of thousands that I am sure they would target well before me. I do not know if they have contacted anyone in Australia.

    After 300 pages of BB I still have no idea how affiliates are supposed to make money. (Other than recruiting) And now BitCoins, one of the firsts things I found on Google was someone had their BitWallet hacked for 250,000 bit coins, oh the injustice.
    I'm wondering what BB you are talking about. There is only about 10 pages on the whole site plus another couple if you became a member.
    How do affiliates make money? It is a revenue share model. Once the products are out, yes that means not yet, affiliates will earn as 50% of revenue is shared with members. They do this with tiered levels which ensures that the value is held for each position. Members also get a bonus revenue share based on the matrix as I mentioned in my last post. This is not a set amount either, instead it is based on a % of members earnings. Complicated for some but easy to understand once you 'get it'.
    I haven't read about the bitcoin hacking but that is a lot of bitcoin for someone to have. Todays price that would be over $11 million dollars. People have their bank accounts hacked, credit card fraud, savings ripped off, everywhere there is money there will be some people that have been ripped off.

    It's being promoted as a get-rich-quick scheme by anonymous posters on ALL the usual suspect HYIP ponzi forums AND is all froth and bubble theory.
    I have not seen any promotion saying you will make money quick with this. Promotion saying you can make money later with the revenue share yes, but nothing saying you will get rich quick. As far as anonymous posters, well I am far from anonymous and I know several other people that are promoting it and they do not try to be anonymous either. Quite the opposite actually as they give their details to help people.

  18. #43
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by ribshaw View Post
    Aussie, I am sure others with a better understanding of the online world will have a better set of questions, but a few come up on my end.
    1. What on earth is a bitcoin, bitty bitty or whatever it is called, and why should I need them? For instance, I frequently shop Amazon, Ebay via Pay Pal, recently booked two trips on a travel site, all with my credit card. That card is linked electronically to my bank account, so I can wire them payment at the end of the month. No muss, no fuss. Why would I switch?
    I don't see anyone switching in a hurry although from what I have heard there are some analyists saying that bitcoin could replace whole currencies. That may be a long way off yet but apparently bitcoin is a lot less prone to fraud than credit cards and other transfer methods. Still personally I cannot see it making a big difference for many years. Still during that time it will be interesting to see its progress. There is certainly a lot of interest in it and not much of the interest is from people in the so called 'Ponzi Forums'. Most of the interest is from people in financial circles.

    2. It seems to me, and forgive my ignorance if I am missing something that the whole gist of the pitch is that I recruit people and make money. Fair enough, but if this is a change the world technology why would people not just use in the same fashion they use Google or Facebook?
    Actually the gist of it is that you can become a founder and have a better share of revenue income. For it all to work they need a good size membership base. The target is 50,000. To do what they want to do they need the membership first or it just will not work properly. It is a bit like skype, in the beginning the program was not as reliable because they did not have the membership to make it good. As membership grew it became much more reliable and better in general. Same concept but with more than just a skype type application. Recruiting other members you will earn a referral commission, sure, but that is not meant to be the main compensation, although I am sure some people will do very well just from that alone.

    3. As for the investment, it seems recruiting driven which to me always throws up a red flag. Not just that it is a scam, but overly complex. Why on earth are you not seeking venture capital funding or if you don't want to give up ownership the way some VCs may want, why not seek a few investors who are large in size? Just seems to me a 7x7 matrix with a bunch of folks throwing in $50 and getting their friends to throw in the same is overly complex and costly. I also question if it is profitable as a business strategy as it costs money to do accounting and printing 1099s or similar for all these investors.
    Thank you.
    Venture capital will not help in this case. Not in the way you think anyway. Ownership is everyone owns it so you can't really have venture capitalists, that would sort of defeat the whole concept. The big need is for the membership numbers. Referral commissions are to aid in creating faster membership growth. This is not only used for online programs. In Australia I have satelite tv and if I refer someone I get a $50 reward. Some electricity companies give discounts or gift cards to members that refer others, Phone companies sometimes reward members who bring others in. It is not a new concept, nor is it confined to online business.

    It is a 7x3 matrix, not 7x7 and although a bitcoin has jumped in value and is nearing $50, It started at $28 when this was first being promoted.

    Hope that helps

  19. #44
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    If a program without product or service needs desperately affiliates to progress,You can bet it's a scam for the simple reason it must sell illusions instead of the product.If you want to get money from illusions then better play lottery - at least you know what are you dealing with....and....stay bloody away from complcated to understand programs...remember...it's not complicated without reason...no...no

  20. #45
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Mundorf View Post
    ....stay bloody away from complcated to understand programs...
    Truer words were never spoken.

  21. #46
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Aussie, thank you for taking the time to respond.

    To clarify a few points of my original post the "BB" I was referring to was Banners Brokers, which I still have no idea how it works, again other than recruiting. The $250,000 hack was in fact in real dollars from a Bitcoin wallet. Although you do bring up another good point, if my bank account, brokerage account, or credit card is hacked I have full recourse with very limited liability. Not to overstate a point but to truly become a recognized currency for world wide commerce this would really need to be addressed.

    In the second order of importance in my mind it seems you would need vendors who accept bit coins and not founders to adopt the technology. The only application I see other than a few Sovereign Citizens who don't trust the government and a few techies would be for industries where customers may want discretion like porn or shells who want to launder money. Other than discretion, why bother? Unless of course it is speculation.

    I found a chart in Wired magazine of the value of bit coins converted to real currency and it looks like any other speculative bubble, from Tulip Mania to the DotCom. It peaked and crashed in 2011 and now appears to be on the rise again according to an online calculator. If people want to speculate, fine, but it never ends well for the (m)asses.

    As for Dish Network, lots of companies give referral fees but they don't make you a "founder" or "owner", they give you a little bonus to save them the real cost of obtaining a new user. It costs most businesses several hundred dollars to obtain a new customer, so $50 is a deal for them. And goes to my previous point that unless the sole goal is endless recruiting it just does not make financial sense to bring in $50 accounts as they cost more to service than they generate in revenue.

    To me it seems overly complex and a gamble that I can recruit others who can recruit others and/or flip my bitcoins to someone at a higher price. That just does not seem like a real business model other than for the get rich quick crowd. So I would say if you don't want your business promoted in the ponzi forms you should change your model. Focus your time on signing up vendors who want to be paid in bitcoins, and then figure a reason the general public would adopt their use.

  22. #47
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    If a program without product or service needs desperately affiliates to progress,You can bet it's a scam for the simple reason it must sell illusions instead of the product.If you want to get money from illusions then better play lottery - at least you know what are you dealing with....and....stay bloody away from complcated to understand programs...remember...it's not complicated without reason...no
    There is a difference when the product you have relies on peer to peer and to that end requires a certain amount of users to make it work properly. I believe that is the issue here. As for being complicated, the only complicated part is getting a bitcoin. That is only complicated because most new members have never done it before.

    Quote Originally Posted by ribshaw View Post
    Aussie, thank you for taking the time to respond.

    To clarify a few points of my original post the "BB" I was referring to was Banners Brokers, which I still have no idea how it works, again other than recruiting. The $250,000 hack was in fact in real dollars from a Bitcoin wallet. Although you do bring up another good point, if my bank account, brokerage account, or credit card is hacked I have full recourse with very limited liability. Not to overstate a point but to truly become a recognized currency for world wide commerce this would really need to be addressed.

    In the second order of importance in my mind it seems you would need vendors who accept bit coins and not founders to adopt the technology. The only application I see other than a few Sovereign Citizens who don't trust the government and a few techies would be for industries where customers may want discretion like porn or shells who want to launder money. Other than discretion, why bother? Unless of course it is speculation.

    I found a chart in Wired magazine of the value of bit coins converted to real currency and it looks like any other speculative bubble, from Tulip Mania to the DotCom. It peaked and crashed in 2011 and now appears to be on the rise again according to an online calculator. If people want to speculate, fine, but it never ends well for the (m)asses.

    As for Dish Network, lots of companies give referral fees but they don't make you a "founder" or "owner", they give you a little bonus to save them the real cost of obtaining a new user. It costs most businesses several hundred dollars to obtain a new customer, so $50 is a deal for them. And goes to my previous point that unless the sole goal is endless recruiting it just does not make financial sense to bring in $50 accounts as they cost more to service than they generate in revenue.

    To me it seems overly complex and a gamble that I can recruit others who can recruit others and/or flip my bitcoins to someone at a higher price. That just does not seem like a real business model other than for the get rich quick crowd. So I would say if you don't want your business promoted in the ponzi forms you should change your model. Focus your time on signing up vendors who want to be paid in bitcoins, and then figure a reason the general public would adopt their use.
    Ah Banners Broker, I still get asked to join in fact I was asked last night. I always thought of it as a well disguised ponzi that made people use their earnings to progress further, thus reducing the liability to the company and prolonging its use by date. I must admit I haven't looked lately and they have exceeded the time I expected them to last. Maybe it is the one program that defies my prediction of ultimate failure. Every other one I predicted in the last 2 years is already dead.

    Yes easy to find chart of the value. The stockmarket chart probably looks the same but plenty follow it. Same with a lot of currency charts. An interesting article I found just today about the value is worth a read The Target Value For Bitcoin Is Not Some $50 Or $100. It Is $100,000 To $1,000,000. - Falkvinge on Infopolicy

    I still dont understand your point about the referral commissions. You talk about the sole goal of endless recruiting but the goal is getting a big enough membership to launch the products. You seem to be talking about it without the products in mind. Also I have no idea what costs there would be to service an account. I don't see there being any cost.

    Your last paragraph once again seems to miss the point again. You are talking about this with no products in mind. I agree with you if there was no intention to make a product then this would just be a ponzi. Flipping bitcoins is not part of the business at all but sure people probably do that. I doubt members joining bitbillions would be confident enough to deal with bitcoins in that way. Others in the bitcoin community might be. Your last setence is all about bitcoins and what they are doing...maybe you have bitcoins mixed up with bitbillions.

    To recap in regard to GBBG revenue and products;

    Members will not be required to spend money on products or services in order to earn their share of GBBGs revenues. Revenue will be generated through advertising, premium communication services, payment processing, currency exchanges, sales of books, sales of music, sales of movies, and many other income producing mediums. Members simply earn money by using the FREE technology. Some of our FREE services will include:

    Communication with anyone, anywhere in the world, including unlimited global telephone calling
    Access to the largest database of music, movies, and books on earth
    Global payment processing, currency exchange, and banking with NO FEES
    Much, much more

  23. #48
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Here is what I ultimately think, this is a "Pig in the Poke" for the internet era.

    Here is my non cyber analogy:
    You are going to build a fantastic mall with all my favorite stores where I can have anything I want for free. Right now, you can't tell me what stores will be there, but TRUST ME you will like them. The only hold up is we don't have enough shoppers for the new mall, because everyone hates free stuff. If I just throw in a few bucks, I become a "founder" in the mall, and I will be paid while I wait for the mall to open. Then when the mall opens not only do I get to shop for free, but I have the chance to make $23000.01 from each $1million in revenue. Why do I need so much income if everything in my life is now going to be free? And where does the revenue come from if everything is free? According to your last blurb:

    Members will not be required to spend money on products or services in order to earn their share of GBBGs revenues. Revenue will be generated through advertising, premium communication services, payment processing, currency exchanges, sales of books, sales of music, sales of movies, and many other income producing mediums. Members simply earn money by using the FREE technology. Some of our FREE services will include:

    Communication with anyone, anywhere in the world, including unlimited global telephone calling
    Access to the largest database of music, movies, and books on earth
    Global payment processing, currency exchange, and banking with NO FEES
    Much, much more
    [/B]

    In other words, all the good stuff will cost money, or you will have to put up with a bunch of advertising while you are at your computer. Or hey for $50 you can become a member and get all the goodies for free.

    I hate to take it out of cyberspace, but the only thing I see at this point is promises, and being paid to recruit. If I had to guess, the "founders" will be hit up several times for more funding, before someone steals the technology, or the site goes dark.

  24. #49
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    [QUOTE=aussie_striker;47740]There is a difference when the product you have relies on peer to peer and to that end requires a certain amount of users to make it work properly. I believe that is the issue here. As for being complicated, the only complicated part is getting a bitcoin. That is only complicated because most new members have never done it before.

    My assessment is it is overly complicated because it makes people think they are getting in on something huge. I reread the thread last night including the advertising piece initially posted. To me the first two paragraphs say absolutely nothing, just a bunch of run on cyber babble. It could be that I am just a dinosaur, but can you actually explain it in a short easy to understand manner?



    Yes easy to find chart of the value. The stockmarket chart probably looks the same but plenty follow it. Same with a lot of currency charts. An interesting article I found just today about the value is worth a read The Target Value For Bitcoin Is Not Some $50 Or $100. It Is $100,000 To $1,000,000. - Falkvinge on Infopolicy

    This is an interesting side discussion, I can find the same predictions for gold, google, and beanie babies. And you can be sure I will follow the speculation aspect as I find it fascinating.


    I still dont understand your point about the referral commissions. You talk about the sole goal of endless recruiting but the goal is getting a big enough membership to launch the products. You seem to be talking about it without the products in mind. Also I have no idea what costs there would be to service an account. I don't see there being any cost.

    Two things, right now there are no products only promises of products. "Pig in a Poke", the only thing any of us are sure of at this point is you can be paid to recruit. Any idea how many programs never get any further than that? This would have been huge in 1997. The second is just generating 1099s or similar tax forms costs a business money, never mind the accounting and compliance across borders. The only way this is not a cost, is if you don't plan on being in compliance with local laws and are just running a script.

    Your last setence is all about bitcoins and what they are doing...maybe you have bitcoins mixed up with bitbillions.


    You are right, but they seem to be joined at the hip, unless the founders are just trowing "BIT" into the mix they way everyone used to throw ".COM" on the end of every crappy business in the world to raise funds.

  25. #50
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    Re: Bit Billions - bitbillions.com

    Your last setence is all about bitcoins and what they are doing...maybe you have bitcoins mixed up with bitbillions.


    You are right, but they seem to be joined at the hip, unless the founders are just trowing "BIT" into the mix they way everyone used to throw ".COM" on the end of every crappy business in the world to raise funds.
    bits, that is what is about - but BitBillions is different...
    Don't get ripped off!! Stay informed!

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