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Thread: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

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    Seattle is offline Member
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    Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Fraud_Alert.jpg

    This is long story that so I will cut to the chase... Echinacities.com is owned by a communist party member named George Xu. He earns a ton of money selling stuff and ads on his expat portal. His biggest business is ad sales and he apparently doesn't mind selling ads to con artists and and identity thieves that his own forum users identified many times. Instead of refusing to accept the ads, he deleted and banned the users who exposed the crooked advertisers!

    More recently, like maybe two weeks ago, news hit that he was caught selling confidential resumes to anyone with cash including GTeachers.org and other known and suspected identity thieves. Victims have started popping up on line but some hacker has been deleting (corrupting the links) within a few days of the posts showing up.

    The story got more interesting after a former Moderator who worked over a year for George at ECC ("Traveler" was his user name) made some "interesting" disclosures and admitted George did business with the many dishonest advertisers and buyers. All the links can be found here with a few more details:

    Avoid Scam Job Ads From Echinacities.com - They sell your resumes and post personal ID online! ID Thieves Cooperate! - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews
    China Fraud Patrol: Is Echinacities.com a Scam Front for Identity Thieves or Only China Job Recruiters?
    http://www.scam.com/showthread.php?t=620902
    https://www.scamwarners.com/forum/vi...?f=34&p=220890

    Anyway, if you are looking for a job in China, Echinacities.com is not the place to be sending your resume. I think before you do any business in China you maybe want to check all the blacklists first. It seems Echinacities probably just earned a spot on a few of those lists!

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    For posterity, just in case



    ESL Watch info
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Interesting.

    The EchinaCities.com WHOIS, DNS, & Domain Info - DomainTools gives;
    It took a little bit (under 2 minutes) to discover that SICTEC was a acronym for the Sino-Canada Technology Excange Centre in Markham (Toronto area), Canada.

    SICTEC's whois is also under the name George Xu.

    Their Homepage;
    Two interesting things here;
    One is that the 'Job in China' tab is a link which leads to echinacities.com. That pretty much confirms that they have something to do with that website.

    Second, the 'Contact Us' tab gives the address for the main office in Canada and a branch office in Beijing, China.



    But, who is George Xu and the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Centre?

    A Google Search for "SINO-CANADA TECHNOLOGY EXCHANGE CENTER" (yes I did use quotation marks there) found a number of interesting results. I really couldn't decide where to start here so I'll start with one that mentions George Xu also.
    Note: I have edited most of the following to save space. The parts edited out are symbolized by ......., however links to the full articles are provided.

    globalnews.ca;
    October 31, 2012 12:54 pm

    Chinese officials seek Canadian anti-smuggling secrets
    By Rebecca Lindell Global News

    OTTAWA – Chinese government officials are making a concerted effort to learn about Canada’s work to prevent high-tech smuggling – an effort security experts warn could help fuel the multi-billion dollar industrial espionage business.

    Global News has learned the Canada Border Services Agency met in Ottawa with a Chinese government delegation from the province of Guangdong on Sept. 13 to discuss Canadian efforts to combat smuggling.

    The meeting in September was set up by George Xu, the head of the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Centre, an organization that sets up visits between Canadian and Chinese government delegations.

    Sources told Global News Xu sent invitations to similar Canadian groups asking to discuss contraband trade, human trafficking and illegal immigration, as well as Canada’s “experience and strategies” in regard to the “illicit traffic of critical high technology and strategic goods.”
    .......(click for full article)
    abqjournal.com;
    Organic produce operation innovative
    By Kevin Robinson-Avila / Journal Staff Writer
    PUBLISHED: Monday, February 25, 2013 at 12:05 am
    ...............
    In January, the Chinese Academy of Agricultural Sciences led a delegation of 20 top-ranking scientists on a tour of Preferred Produce’s new operation in California.

    Weiping Gao, program coordinator for the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Center in Toronto, said her institute organized the tour because Preferred Produce’s operation is uniquely forward-looking.
    ..........
    news.psu.edu (Penn State University)
    Delegation of top Chinese scientists visits Department of Kinesiology
    November 19, 2012

    UNIVERSITY PARK, Pa. -- A delegation of top sport and exercise scientists from China visited faculty and staff members from Penn State's Department of Kinesiology, the Department of Intercollegiate Athletics, and the Golf Teaching and Research Center during the week of Nov. 12 to learn about the latest in scientific research and training in their field.
    ....................
    The visitors from China were selected from a much larger group of professionals for the trip through a national competition. During the trip to the United States, the delegation also visited the University of Connecticut as well as institutions in Washington, D.C., and Philadelphia.
    ...............
    Buckley said that researchers from Penn State and the Chinese delegation already are planning to collaborate in the future through the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Center, which is contracted by the China State General Sports Administration to promote, develop and lead academic and business exchanges in order to encourage international collaboration.
    ..
    peralta.edu (A group of four colleges in the San Francisco Bay area.)
    Representatives from Chinese College Visit College of Alameda to Learn Best Practices
    24 January 2013

    On Friday January 18, 2013 representatives from the Guangxi College of Water Resource and Electric Power in China visited College of Alameda – one of the four Peralta Colleges that includes Berkeley City College and Laney and Merritt Colleges in Oakland – for the purpose of promoting international cooperation and exchange of knowledge and best practices. The visit was coordinated through the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Center, which is based in Toronto with a branch office in Beijing, China. Its mandate is to promote the professional and business exchanges between China and North America. The center is also authorized by the Chinese government to coordinate visiting programs for the Chinese government agencies and departments in Canada and the United States.

    Interested in developing international cooperation and exchange programs with well-established U.S. higher educational institutions – in their efforts to promote innovative educational programming and quality education with a distinctive character – the Guangxi College of Water Resource and Electric Power, through the efforts of the Sino-Canadian Technology Exchange Center, organized a delegation of 20 faculty, staff and administrators to visit the College of Alameda.
    ..........
    cambridge.ca (A .pdf from the City of Cambridge, Ontario Canada.)
    Media Advisory
    Chinese Delegation to Visit Cambridge

    Sharing Best Practices for Business Development Cambridge, Ontario. August 16, 2011... A high level group of government officials from China will visit the City of Cambridge to forge international relations and learn about new and emerging economic development practices at the City. The group represents a variety of Chinese government operations including representatives from the People’s Government of Beijing Municipality, Shunyi District People’s Government, Haidian District People’s
    Government, Dongcheng District People’s Government, Yanging County People’s Government, Zhongguancun Science Park and Beijing Municipal Science and Technology Commission.
    ............
    The mission is being coordinated by the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Centre, a Toronto-based group authorized by the Chinese government.
    ......
    ontarioshores.ca (A .pdf from the Ontario Shores Centre for Mental Health Sciences.)
    2009-2010 Interprofessional Research and Academic Annual Report
    .........
    Conference Presentations
    ...........
    Presented at: Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Center (2010)
    Authors: Nussbaum, D.
    Title: An introduction to the Canadian forensic and correctional systems.
    Format: Oral
    ........
    maryland.gov (A .pdf from the State of Maryland.)
    OFFICE OF ADMINISTRATIVE HEARINGS
    2006 ANNUAL REPORT

    .........
    International
    .......
    On December 13, OAH hosted a Chinese delegation of seventeen government officials from Guizhou provincial Legal Office and municipal legal offices who were visiting the United States to study various subjects related to administrative law and administrative rulemaking. This visit was arranged through the Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Center. The delegation received a presentation and tour of the building from CALJ Dewberry and members of management staff.
    ...
    globalsmes.org
    About GASME

    The Global Alliance of SMEs (GASME) is a non-profit multinational NGO, founded by the US-China Exchange Association (USCEA) with more than one hundred prominent trade organizations from the G20 countries. Headquartered in New Jersey, USA, GASME also has its offices in Shanghai, Washington, Frankfurt, Paris and Lima. In 2012, GASME was granted Consultative Status with United Nations Industrial Development Organization (UNIDO).
    globalsmes.org
    Global Partners of GASME
    ...........
    Sino-Canada Technology Exchange Centre
    ......
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post
    For posterity, just in case
    ESL Watch info
    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post
    Both of those cite the same article by Craig Hill at chinadailymail.com which was written on 18DEC2013, ten months ago.

    Interestingly enough I cited another article from Mr. Hill just last Feb. here at RS, eight moths ago. This article is dated 14JUL2013 (five months prior to the article cited above) and also mentions echinacities.com.
    2014 Work Abroad China Foreign Teacher Recruiter & School Scam Blacklist Available - Free

    What is interesting about this second article is the editor's note which appears at the bottom;
    The link in this editor's note is now dead. However, the link also appears at;
    china.edax.org
    geledraak.nl

    There is also, apparently, yet another CFTU article (dated 25MAR2013) linked to at https://www.facebook.com/chinadailym...12028165580714;
    It appears that both of these CFTU articles have been deleted.

    Must be those ubiquitous hackers again.

    Anyway, here are some links on Mr. Hill dated APR and MAY 2013;
    chinadailymailscam.wordpress.com
    craighillchinadailymail.blogspot.com
    China Fraud Patrol: Australian Kenneth Craig Hill aka Craig Hill Is Veteran Scam Artist & China ESL Recruiter Of Foreign Teachers

    I especially liked the last one;
    ........
    Basically, in MAY 2013 Craig Hill (who runs chinadailymail.com) is mentally disturbed, a scammer, a liar, and he is this 'Traveler'.
    But, in SEP 2014 Craig Hill, chinadailymail.com, and this 'Traveler' are great and truthful sources of information.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Well one year and 35 weeks ago, someone called "Pegasus" brought the subject up here Should expat forums accept ads from agents that cheat foreigners?- eChinacities Answers | echinacities and there was no feedback from the ECC admin and no more posts were made from Pegasus - I am assuming he got banned, as was "Tarzan" who posted here about 3 months ago http://http://answers.echinacities.com/node/218470 who asked:

    "How can I apply for a job advertised here at ECC WITHOUT posting my resume and photo online?
    I don't want my current employer to see me looking for a new job and I do not see any option to apply for an advertised job here at ECC that lets us apply WITHOUT posting our resume and photo online. Identity thieves probably love this web site!"


    The guy asked Admin for some explanation but none came. To me this looks like ECC management knows exactly what is going down and wants the cash for those resumes. Banning the users is a big red flag to me.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    Well one year and 35 weeks ago, someone called "Pegasus" brought the subject up here Should expat forums accept ads from agents that cheat foreigners?- eChinacities Answers | echinacities and there was no feedback from the ECC admin and no more posts were made from Pegasus - I am assuming he got banned,
    He was banned alright, but that doesn't appear to be the reason.;
    (Posted about two months later.)
    Is anybody else sick of the guy that keeps making new accounts about the teachers union?- eChinacities Answers | echinacities
    1 year and 28 weeks ago would have been late MAR 2013.
    Wow, the last post in that thread (answers.echinacities.com/node/126049 contains another link to one of the same articles I posted above;
    craighillchinadailymail.blogspot.ca
    Quote Originally Posted by nomaxim View Post
    Anyway, here are some links on Mr. Hill dated APR and MAY 2013;
    craighillchinadailymail.blogspot.com
    Exact same article at two different url's.

    And, thanks for your assistance with my hypothesis that China Scam Patrol and CFTU are one and the same and that they use multiple accounts.
    Ref.



    PS.
    Oh, and I fixed your broken link;
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    You put 'http://' in the url twice.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    The guy asked Admin for some explanation but none came. To me this looks like ECC management knows exactly what is going down and wants the cash for those resumes. Banning the users is a big red flag to me.
    It appears that Admin did address the matter in the last post of this thread:
    Is the China Foreign Teacher's Union actually a Chinese run operation?- eChinacities Answers | echinacities;
    The link mentioned in the post is:
    Profanity | echinacities
    And I believe this is the section being referred too;
    Advertising and Spamming

    Advertisements of any kind are not allowed. Any questions or answers whose sole aim is to plug a business or promote a product will be removed. This includes:

    1) Posting “camouflaged advertisement” answers on a series of old, related questions (“Hey there! I had this problem too, but I can help you! Check out this website: www.####.com or call my cell: ### #### ####”).
    2) Posting a web link, email, Tel # or other direct information about a company or service in your “Signature”, “About Me or “Interests” fields.
    3) Posting specific, personalized questions asking users to help you find a job in China. Broad questions are acceptable (“How do you find a teaching job in Guangzhou?”); specific questions are not (“I want to work in finance in Guangzhou, do you know anyone in the industry?”) Please consult the eChinacities Jobs section instead.
    4) Any other such content deemed blatant advertising by the moderators and/or reported by users.

    Those caught advertising will be dealt with according to the Warning and Banning guidelines . Those caught spamming will be given a single warning; the second offense will result in a permanent ban.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    IMO... Since traveler quit and admitted he was one of many paid users directed to post bogus comments at ECC, as he did at his China Daily Mail blog, then I certainly cannot trust ANYTHING said by the Admin of Echinacities. I also noticed several threads at ECC where as soon as people start talking about censorship on the forum or how companies like China ESL (well known and blacklisted for YEARS as a scam operation) is allowed to post paid ads, then you do not have to be a rocket scientist to see that admin is doing what he is told by Mr. Xu the Chinese CCP owner of the web site. There is active collusion going on between ECC and the people who post the ads and the people who buy the resumes. I think Traveler had a guilt attack and that is why he disassociated himself and tried to do the right thing. I wish he would see this thread and weigh in on everything. But I for one will certainly NEVER send a resume to ECC and many people agree that it is risky proposition. The fact that Traveler exposed these people almost a year ago and the many banned people have been trying to do the same for two years speaks volumes IMO. Every ESL forum and message board has made some negative comment about ECC and not just about the fake ads and ID theft ESL Jobs Forum - View topic - Scam Recruiters Reside At Echinacities.com & eslcafe.com

    I think we just assume that because a web site is big with 100,000 visitors a day they must be honest. No-Maxim... how long have you lived and worked in China? I have a feeling that maybe you never lived and worked here where virtually half of all foreigner get swindled one way or another - and especially the teachers.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    P.S. And even China Scam Patrol outed ECC 18 months ago as one of three websites cooperating with the black hat cowboys of China who think foreign teachers are a free lunch for them China Expat Forums – Friend or Foe? Either Way, A Conflict Of Interest For Sure… | China Scam Patrol
    I moved to Beijing and work here and I see it every day - bars full of expats bitching about how they were duped by either a recruiter or even their own school! Scams are the reality of China!

    Beware of agents & recruiters masquerading as ESL/TEFL teachers at expat & ESL.TEFL forums! - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews

    Too many agents & recruiters now posting as teachers on expat forums | the Beijinger

    TEFL forums - Did you notice the fake teachers posting on ESL/TEFL forums?

    http://www.chinascamwatch.wordpress.com

    ESL Jobs Forum - View topic - China Forum Job Scam Fraud Is Getting Outrageous!

    chinablacklist | Look Before You Leap – China Is A Scam Minefield!

    Even the Admin at thebeijinger.com admitted that keeping up with the phony ads was overwhelming and consuming his staff. Let be real friend, this foreign teacher fraud is all about money in China and nobody give's a rat's ass about whether the teachers get scammed or not so long as ECC gets their cut, the resume buyers make a profit, and the ID thieves get the lion's share. We teachers are the bottom of the food chain.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    I also noticed several threads at ECC where as soon as people start talking about censorship on the forum or how companies like China ESL is allowed to post paid ads, then you do not have to be a rocket scientist to see that admin is doing what he is told by Mr. Xu the Chinese CCP owner of the web site.
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    I moved to Beijing and work here and I see it every day
    ............
    We teachers are the bottom of the food chain.
    Right, your a foreign teacher living in China and have absolutely no idea that China has the most censored internet in the world. Imposed by the Chinese government.

    Censorship in China -Wiki;
    Reporters Without Borders ranks China's press situation as "very serious", the worst ranking on their five-point scale. In August 2012 the OpenNet Initiative classified Internet censorship in China as "pervasive" in the political and conflict/security areas and "substantial" in the social and Internet tools areas, the two most extensive classifications of the five they use. Freedom House ranks the press there as "not free", the worst ranking, saying that "state control over the news media in China is achieved through a complex combination of party monitoring of news content, legal restrictions on journalists, and financial incentives for self-censorship," and an increasing practice of "cyber-disappearance" of material written by or about activist bloggers.
    Since echinacities.com is hosted in Beijing they must therefore comply with Chinese laws and regulations.

    Another article Internet censorship in China -Wiki even goes as far as giving a list of things you should not post about on Chinese websites;
    Legislative basis
    The Ordinance regulation further led to the Security Management Procedures in Internet Accessing issued by the Ministry of Public Security in December 1997. The regulation defines "harmful information" and "harmful activities" regarding internet usage. Section Five of the Computer Information Network and Internet Security, Protection, and Management Regulations approved by the State Council on 11 December 1997 states the following:

    No unit or individual may use the Internet to create, replicate, retrieve, or transmit the following kinds of information:

    1. Inciting to resist or breaking the Constitution or laws or the implementation of administrative regulations;
    2. Inciting to overthrow the government or the socialist system;
    3. Inciting division of the country, harming national unification;
    4. Inciting hatred or discrimination among nationalities or harming the unity of the nationalities;
    5. Making falsehoods or distorting the truth, spreading rumors, destroying the order of society;
    6. Promoting feudal superstitions, sexually suggestive material, gambling, violence, murder;
    7. Terrorism or inciting others to criminal activity; openly insulting other people or distorting the truth to slander people;
    8. Injuring the reputation of state organizations;
    9. Other activities against the Constitution, laws or administrative regulations.
    These rules have been in effect since 1997 and violating these laws can lead to arrest.
    Arrests
    Fines and short arrests are becoming an optional punishment to whoever expresses undesirable information through the different Internet formats, as this is seen as a risk to social stability.

    In 2001, Wang Xiaoning and other Chinese activists were arrested and sentenced to 10 years in prison for using a Yahoo email account to post anonymous writing to an Internet mailing list. On 23 July 2008, the family of Liu Shaokun was notified that he had been sentenced to one year re-education through labor for "inciting a disturbance". As a teacher in Sichuan province, he had taken photographs of collapsed schools and posted these photos online. On 18 July 2008, Huang Qi was formally arrested on suspicion of illegally possessing state secrets. Huang had spoken with the foreign press and posted information on his website about the plight of parents who had lost children in collapsed schools. Shi Tao, a Chinese journalist, used his Yahoo! email account to send a message to a U.S.-based pro-democracy website. In his email, he summarized a government order directing media organizations in China to downplay the upcoming 15th anniversary of the 1989 crackdown on pro-democracy activists. Police arrested him in November 2004, charging him with "illegally providing state secrets to foreign entities". In April 2005, he was sentenced to 10 years' imprisonment and two years' subsequent deprivation of his political rights.

    In mid-2013 police across China announced the arrests of hundreds of people accused of spreading false rumors online. Chinese authorities have said the crackdown is directed at abuses such as fraud, fakery, and slander. But the accusations against many of the arrested microbloggers have a political edge with many of the rumors called outrageously false by the government dealing with the sins of officials: corruption, venality, and sexual escapades. The suspicion is that the crackdown is intended to break up online networks of like-minded people whose ideas could challenge the Communist Party. Some of China's most popular microbloggers have been arrested. In September 2013 China’s highest court and prosecution office issued guidelines that define and outline penalties for punishing online rumors and slander. The rules give some protection to citizens who accuse officials of corruption, but they say that a slanderous message forwarded more than 500 times or read more than 5,000 times could result in up to three years in prison.
    I would recommend leaving China immediately since you are having a problem understanding that you have no freedom of speech there.

    Perhaps head down to Hong Kong.
    Last edited by nomaxim; 10-07-2014 at 03:15 PM.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    P.S. And even China Scam Patrol outed ECC 18 months ago as one of three websites cooperating with the black hat cowboys of China who think foreign teachers are a free lunch for them (url edited out-nomaxim)
    I moved to Beijing and work here and I see it every day - bars full of expats bitching about how they were duped by either a recruiter or even their own school! Scams are the reality of China!

    eslwatch.info/china-2/scams-or-schemes-in-china/12147-beware-of-agents-recruiters-masquerading-as-esl-tefl-teachers-at-expat-esl-tefl-forums.

    ...............
    May I also suggest reading the Disclaimer at ESLWatch.info;
    Two important points here;
    1. Please note that we cannot and do not accept any responsibility for the accuracy of any of the information contained in any and all articles written by Third Parties. Take any opinions or experiences posted with caution, since none of them have been confirmed or verified in any way.

    2. Readers should exercise great caution and when reading any posts, and should consider any post to be that of opinion and not fact.

    Since you seem to like to link to ESLWacth.info as if the articles there are important facts, I thought I would point out that ESLWatch.info says otherwise.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Thank you for all the red herrings No Maxim but you still did not tell us: HOW LONG HAVE YOU LIVED AND WORKED IN CHINA?

    I am more inclined to believe people with first hand experience from people who have been living and working in China for years. You seem to be a guy who thinks the party who has the last word wins the argument.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    Thank you for all the red herrings No Maxim but you still did not tell us: HOW LONG HAVE YOU LIVED AND WORKED IN CHINA?
    I've never claimed to have even visited China.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    I am more inclined to believe people with first hand experience from people who have been living and working in China for years.
    I've worked with Chinese nationals for about 20 years. First was in the mid-90's when I was still a grad student at another University. In fact, I've worked with individuals from dozens of countries over the years.

    Kent State in China -. And as stated at this link, KSU has relationships with several Chinese Universities. There are also programs for our students to go to China to study and teach. Not sure of the exact numbers that are in these exchange programs. But, generally around 1,000 underclassmen and graduate students per year and maybe a dozen or two professors.


    Personally, I would not recommend anyone go to to any country to study or teach outside of collegiate programs. These types of programs are usually pretty well vetted. Doesn't mean you won't have problems however.



    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    I moved to Beijing and work here and I see it every day - bars full of expats bitching about how they were duped by either a recruiter or even their own school!
    Unless, of course, you think getting the facts from drunks in bars is more appealing.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Do you realize you are defending a guy who used to sell animal parts on his web site like bear bile, ivory, and rhino horn? Is this not proof enough that George Xu has no conscience and will do anything for money? http://annamiticus.com/2013/07/06/ch...orn-bear-bile/

    And I agree with Seattle... you openly admit that you have never set foot in China and have no first hand experience getting scammed over here.

    I also see you are master of twisting words around. Where did Seattle say he was speaking with "drunks" in a bar? Are YOU a drunk? Then why do you assume only drunks go to a bar? Who are you and what do YOU do for a living that qualifies you to judge people you never have met from 4,000 miles away? GET REAL!
    Last edited by Frankly My Dear...; 10-07-2014 at 08:57 PM.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankly My Dear... View Post
    Do you realize you are defending a guy who used to sell animal parts on his web site like bear bile, ivory, and rhino horn? Is this not proof enough that George Xu has no conscience and will do anything for money? http://annamiticus.com/2013/07/06/ch...orn-bear-bile/
    Seems to be a problem with your link.

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankly My Dear... View Post
    And I agree with Seattle... you openly admit that you have never set foot in China and have no first hand experience getting scammed over here.
    Well, strawman fallacy aside.
    Perhaps you should try another website with people that have. Your not getting much response from them here.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    China Scammer George Xu Helps Poachers Advertise Animal Parts At Echinacities.com

    I think Frank was trying to share this with us which is posted over at scam.com eChinacities.com. rhino horn - ANNAMITICUS Only a fine ethical businessman like George Xu would help poachers sell their illegal goods on his China website right? Off course you will say he had no idea, and some employee must have done this behind his back right?

    article-2080248-0F4CBB6D00000578-209_472x314.jpg

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    Re: China Scammer George Xu Helps Poachers Advertise Animal Parts At Echinacities.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankly My Dear... View Post
    Do you realize you are defending a guy who used to sell animal parts on his web site like bear bile, ivory, and rhino horn? Is this not proof enough that George Xu has no conscience and will do anything for money?
    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    I think Frank was trying to share this with us which is posted over at scam.com eChinacities.com. rhino horn - ANNAMITICUS Only a fine ethical businessman like George Xu would help poachers sell their illegal goods on his China website right? Off course you will say he had no idea, and some employee must have done this behind his back right?
    Thanks for the proper link.

    eChinacities.com. rhino horn - ANNAMITICUS
    Wonderful.
    Adverts containing illegal content where reported to and removed by echinacities.com.

    Not much different then any number of threads here at RS concerning things like cash-gifters and their U-Tube videos.

    If you feel that annamiticus.com is thanking George Xu personally, well that's up to you.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: China Scammer George Xu Helps Poachers Advertise Animal Parts At Echinacities.com

    Sorry, I ran out of time this morning and was unable to finish the above post.

    The above 'Thank You' was posted 7JUL2013.

    The article it refers to was posted the day before on 6JUL2013.
    That article can be found at Chinese Website Displays Adverts for Rhino Horn, Bear Bile [UPDATED] :: ANNAMITICUS
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Thank you for confirming and proving with your last post that Echinacities DOES NOT SCREEN THEIR ADS so ANYONE including unregistered recruiters and identity thieves can post a fake ad online without detection. Also it was only after 10 days of public outrgae and protest that ECC removed the ads about the animal parts for sale. It does not take 10 days fro a web editor to remove any ad - more like 2 minutes - if they wanted to. And although SOME of the ads can be user generated, SOME of them are created in-house by staff. This has been admitted by former employees of ECC. Also try this experiment as I just did... I just registered at ECC and attempted to place a fake job ad using a very plain name. The automated posting process accepted my ad and is now "pending moderator approval". So in fact, even if ads are "user generated" someone at ECC still has the final word whether that ad goes on line or not. Someone chose to allow those poacher ads, and the ID thief ads, and the fake job ads to go online. Admit it already.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Man you guys are mixing too many apples with oranges and splitting hairs here. The down and dirty of it all is that Echinacities.com is just another Chinese scam that make money any way it can. And unless 500 foreigners go protest in front of their offices they will just keep scamming people and laughing at your posts. It is crystal clear to me that ECC has a documented history of censorship, fabricated users and posts, fake reviews and testimonials, poacher collusion, and now this ID theft thing is just icing on the cake. "Traveler" was part of the problem in the past when he did what he was told to collect a paycheck, but today I see him as part of the solution. He even kept his old email logs and is now using them to show that the paid ads from crooks was a problem for years. The attachment on this post shows that "traveler" did not like being part of the ECC scam and is almost two years old http://www.scam.com/showpost.php?p=1...tcount=6%C2%A0

    I personally met a foreign manager from ECC named Elizabeth and I have no idea if she still works there or not but I know that three years ago she was not happy with the owner's way of doing things and even referred to him as "a shady guy" and "very clever". In China, "clever" is defined by being able to rip off people without them even knowing it. My guess is that she probably left like Traveler. Only the ECC insiders know the real truth and they are probably being paid well to shut up. Thanks Traveler and China Scam Patrol who first tried to warn people about ECC on April 14, 2013 - more than 18 months ago China Expat Forums – Friend or Foe? Either Way, A Conflict Of Interest For Sure… | China Scam Patrol

    Maybe ECC is no better or worse than other expat forums in China and they simply were the ones to get caught. I dunno, but they will never get a resume from me.

  22. #22
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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Seattle View Post
    Also it was only after 10 days of public outrgae and protest that ECC removed the ads about the animal parts for sale. It does not take 10 days fro a web editor to remove any ad - more like 2 minutes - if they wanted to.
    Really, well let's look at that.

    The original article- Chinese Website Displays Adverts for Rhino Horn, Bear Bile [UPDATED] :: ANNAMITICUS
    I see "Posted on: Jul 05, 2013 10:37" on the ad and "Date: 06 Jul 2013" for the article itself.

    The 'Thank You' page- Chinese Website Removes Rhino Horn, Bear Bile Adverts :: ANNAMITICUS;
    I see the date on this article as "Date: 07 Jul 2013"

    Are you sure you aren't getting the '10' figure from further down on the main article?
    Chinese Website Displays Adverts for Rhino Horn, Bear Bile [UPDATED] :: ANNAMITICUS
    Are you perhaps having some difficulty distinguishing between 'hours' and 'days'
    And do you still wish to claim that 7-6=10?

    I'm hoping that you just haven't actually read the relative pages. If that is the case, I'd point out two other parts of the main article;
    The mid-paragraph;
    Also three of the comments at the bottom of the article.
    Note that there are 6 comments total all dated 6-7 July 2013
    It appears that the author of the article is not holding echinacities responsible for the ad.
    And one of the commentators appears to be pointing out that no crime was likely committed.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Dude you are defending scammers by assuming everything and denying the obvious... Every ad placed at Echinacities.com is held for "moderator approval" whether it is "user generated" or not!!!!! Like Seattle says, some ECC EMPLOYEE has to give the green light for ads to go live online. They posted it, got caught, and deleted it - end of story. You keep saying "it appears" like "It appears that the author of the article is not holding ECC rsponsible for the ad". That is a bald assumption and conjecture made by YOU!

    Traveler does not beat around the bush and assumed nothing. He gave us the naked facts that George Xu regularly accepted paid ads from known scam artists. Cut the crap No-Maxim and call a spade a spade. George Xu is a devious guy - pure and simple. Whether he is a millionaire or a street vendor makes no difference. He thinks and acts like a criminal and then lets his staff take the blame. I do not want to get into the circumstances of how and why I met the ECC manager Elizabeth three years ago, but she basically had the same opinion of George Xu as Traveler and described him as "shady" and "clever". Meanwhile you are sitting in Stow, Ohio admitting that you never once even visited China, defending some slimy communist party Chinese guy who has not a single molecule of ethics nor honor flowing through his veins. You are probably one of the morons who also defends George Bush and Cheney for their fabricated war in Iraq. GFY!

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Relax Tank. This is the same No-Maxim that was banned from Scam.com a while ago. This is his new home. Moving on... This below link is dated March 8th, 2013 - showing that one of many users named "ZIP" tried to expose ECC more than 1.5 years ago by apparently sending PMs to other users http://chinadailymail.files.wordpres...-email-zip.pdf
    Surely old Zip did not know he was tipping off one of the now-confessed paid shill moderator "Traveler" who himself later came clean and posted this "confidential" communication.

    Zip
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    From
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    Categories
    SUPER CONFIDENTIAL PLEASE - We request your help and advice since you are a veteran
    here at ECC...
    George Xu is the Canadian Chinese who owns EChina Cities and he recently instructed his
    web editors to delete any poster who exposes any of his advertisers for scamming
    foreigners.
    The biggest violator is Rebecca Tang of China ESL who pays over $80,000 a year
    to advertise on EChina Cities – Please read all the below links and you will understand WHY
    my friend “Slinky” (user name) was just banned along with the users
    “Pegasus” who started
    to tell the truth on this thread over a month ago that
    they locked before China ESL was
    named.
    They saw it coming and stopped the conversation by locking up the thread.
    http://answers.echinacities.com/node/115523
    1,247 foreign teachers signed a petition to the Minister of Justice to get China ESL
    prosecuted and shut down.
    George was told about this and he still runs her ads!
    Please read the contract at this link that bears the signature of Rebecca Tang from China
    ESL... then read the email to Teacher Cox advising her to come to China on a F visa.
    http://open.salon.com/blog/china_bus...21/chinese_sch...
    If you try to tell this story at EChina Cities you get locked out and banned.
    People were able
    to tell the story at Beijinger
    http://www.thebeijinger.com/forum/20...cca-tang-will-
    rip-you?page=2
    and
    http://www.thebeijinger.com/node/1592803
    Bottom line is that George is taking money from people he knows is scamming us and then
    censoring us from telling the truth.
    You are a veteran poster here.
    Any idea how to warn
    others about this without getting banned?
    Here are more links on the owner of China
    ESL...
    eChinacities Forum
    Answer of the Day
    >>
    Q:
    Easier for teachers to "hate" China
    than other expats working here?
    A:
    Interesting question! At first glance,
    I would be inclined to say
    Traveler
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    Combine that Zip tidbit with everything else published here: http://chinascampatrol.com.wordpress.com including the story CSP published in April of 2013 about Censorship at ECC and it becomes indisputable that ECC managers knew about the ad frauds and were censoring their own users to conceal the fraud - and make it appear as if they didn't know about it. Just like the CIA and KGB did/does old Georgie boy was creating "plausible deniability". Btw... I just called over to ECC and asked for Tank's "Elizabeth" and she still works there, but was out of the office.
    Last edited by Frankly My Dear...; 10-09-2014 at 01:13 AM.

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    Re: Echinacities.com helping Identity Thieves Scam China Foreign Teachers With Job Ads - Beware!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tank View Post
    Dude you are defending scammers by assuming everything and denying the obvious...
    Nice ad-hominem attempt.

    Not so good attempt at a straw-man fallacy though.

    Besides, I'm not defending anyone. Merely providing information, verifying information, and posting opinions on what the information is. This is a discussion forum after all.

    For example, lets look at the last number of posts using simple logic form with mathematical variables.

    Seattle: Mr. Smith is a scammer because 2+2=5 as shown at abc.com.
    nomaxim: Umm, Abc.com says 2+2=4
    Seattle: Abc.com says 7-6=10
    nomaxim: No, abc.com says 7-6=1
    Tank: Nomaxim defends Mr. Smith.

    Do you really need help here understanding that I'm discussing Seattle's mathematical errors (ie. information) and not Mr. Smith.


    As another example I'm going to clarify another claim before it is even brought up here.

    Nationality law of the People's Republic of China- Wiki;
    Dual nationality
    The People's Republic of China does not recognise dual nationality with any other country (Article 3).[6]

    It is generally difficult to have de facto dual nationality of China and another country, due to the provisions for loss of Chinese nationality when a Chinese national naturalises in another country (see "Loss of nationality" above), and the stipulation that a foreigner who naturalises in China cannot retain their foreign nationality (see "Naturalisation" above).

    However, under the Nationality Law it is still possible for a person to have dual nationality of China and another country at birth in some circumstances. For example:

    If they were born in China, to one Chinese-national parent, they are a Chinese national at birth (Article 4). If their other parent is a non-Chinese-national, they may acquire another nationality at birth by jus sanguinis from that parent.

    If they were born outside China, to one or two Chinese-national parents who have not settled abroad, they are a Chinese national at birth (Article 5). They may acquire another nationality at birth by jus soli if they were born in a jus soli country, and/or they may acquire another nationality from their other parent (if only one parent was a Chinese national) by jus sanguinis
    .

    However, one does not have Chinese nationality if their parents (with Chinese nationality) themselves settle permanently outside China. This means in general, most second generation overseas Chinese ("ABC" or "BBC") and most South East Asian nationals with Chinese ethnicity are not Chinese nationals.

    In general, Hong Kong and Macau citizens with Chinese ethnicity are Chinese nationals, regardless if they have dual nationality or not (see below).

    Hong Kong
    ........
    Hong Kong residents of Chinese nationality do not lose their Chinese nationality automatically upon acquiring foreign one(s), in spite of the apparent wording of Article 9.
    ............

    Macau
    Similar implementation for Macau was adopted at the Sixth Session of the Standing Committee of the Ninth National People's Congress on December 29, 1998. Unique provisions includes clarification for individuals of both Chinese and Portuguese descent, who may choose either Chinese or Portuguese nationality without losing right to abode. Negotiations between China and Portugal over Macau were considerably smoother than those between the United Kingdom and China over Hong Kong, and in the former a pragmatic practical agreement was understood making double nationality possible "de facto" for Chinese and Portuguese nationals with a previous or ongoing relation to Macau.
    Underlines added by me.

    'Apparently' dual citizenship is not illegal in China, there are exceptions.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

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