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Thread: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

  1. #26
    littleroundman is offline Administrator
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by EmmaJ25
    If you have time to check out their site which clearly states all of their names and background, go to it now. There is no such thing as a Derrel Yazwa, Brenda Gibson, or Veronica Weintraub. Your lack of even getting their names correct clearly shows how poorly you have researched them.
    Welcome to REALSCAM.com Emma

    I hate to disagree with you on your first posts, but, if you would care to look back in the thread to six posts before yours, you would see THIS post contains a screen grab of and link to NewLife ESLS' own "about" page About - New Life ESL with pictures and bios of the names you mention together with WHOIS of both the NewLife ESL domain registration and I.P. address and hostname





    The names and spelling for which you are criticizing posters come via screen grabs directly from the NewLife ESL site, so I fail to see your point
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  2. #27
    littleroundman is offline Administrator
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    ADMINISTRATOR NOTE:

    The admins and moderators of REALSCAM.com have become aware of a number of inconsistencies in the I.P. addresses of a number of posters in this thread, including multiple posters using the same I.P. address, I.P. addresses not matching the supposed location of posters and multiple wide variations in the supposed location of posters.

    While this may be being done for reasons of privacy and / or protection from "officialdom" while doubt remains as to the legitimacy of some of the posters / posts in the thread (IOW, has the forum become a pawn in some game being played) we will shortly be locking the thread, at least temporarily until we can be sure of the motives of some of its' contributors
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  3. #28
    Beacon is offline Antiauthoritarian skeptic
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by Beacon View Post
    T

    Your lack of even getting their names correct clearly shows how poorly you have researched them.
    TYhis was a comment I should have attributed to Emma and is not originally mane but the irony is probably appropriate. . Apologies.

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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Hey Derrick,

    I'm still waiting for you to answer my five questions above in blue. Can you be straight with us an answer these questions. I will repeat them again for you here...

    1) YOUR CURRENT CHINA REGISTRATION TODAY

    2) WHO IS YOUR SAFEA CONTACT?

    3) WHAT IS YOUR LLC REGISTRATION NUMBER AND WHERE?

    4) WHAT IS THE IRS ID TAXPAYER NUMBER FOR NEW LIFE ESL?

    5) WHO ARE BRENDA GIBSON AND VERONICA WEINTRAUB?



    I was shocked to see that you persuaded the CFTU to come to your defense - sort of:

    China Foreign Teacher News, Updates, & Scam Alerts: New Life ESL May Not Be The Scam You Think It Is...

    But until you answer the above questions publicly and post your LLC and tax return info, I would not trust you to walk my dog Derrick.
    Last edited by Frankly My Dear...; 08-15-2014 at 09:52 AM.

  5. #30
    littleroundman is offline Administrator
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankly My Dear... View Post

    I was shocked to see that you persuaded the CFTU to come to your defense - sort of:
    I don't know about your definition of "sort of" but to me, the article is fairly clear:

    In recent days we have received over three dozen inquiries about New Life ESL - a fairly unknown recruiter that operates no office in China. China labor and commerciallaws mandates that placements of foreign workers in China be done only by recruiters/agents maintain a registered office in China. New Life ESL is violating these laws - whether deliberately or by ignorance matters little.
    We have also ascertained that New Life ESL is not licensed nor authorized to do business in China and is not licensed in the State of Arizona as an employment agency. Their website Blog - New Life ESL went online in June of 2013. According to this link below, Mr. Yazwa had claimed to be registered in Hong Kong, but as of yesterday, there was no HK registration to be found for New Life ESL.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  6. #31
    ribshaw's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post

    Doubt remains as to the legitimacy of some of the posters / posts in the thread (IOW, has the forum become a pawn in some game being played) we will shortly be locking the thread, at least temporarily until we can be sure of the motives of some of its' contributors
    I don't know nuthin bout nuthin, but am suspicious when people who claim they don't normally write reviews just "happen" to show up. Certainly Derrick could clear up a lot of things by highlighting exactly how he is paid, institutions he represents, specific employment arrangements, and of course the license to do business.

    One thing that jumps right out at me in general is teachers having search fees deducted from their salary-- smells scammy. In the US companies that want to recruit top talent pay the fee to the recruiter directly. Maybe things are different in China, but for an employee to pay a recruiter for a job does not say a whole lot more than warm body.

    As highlighted by this little nugget from the contract, is this a job for a sharecropper in a company town? Good bloody grief, traveling 1/2 way around the world to work for $1400 per month and this is what they think of the relationship. Have Fun...

    Are you a sharecropper.JPG

    Pay in Dollars.JPG

    If I were thinking of going overseas to teach I would want to be damn near an expert in the endeavor and then back into finding someone to work with. Going about it the other way seems like a recipe for disaster. I would be very careful before turning over any personal information and/or money.


    SELECTED READING WITH LINKS:

    A foreign teacher earns $25,000 a year on average while the recruiter who found him to work in one of 17,000 schools and “learning” or “training centers” scattered over 32 provinces average $75,000 a year legally, and perhaps twice as much illegally selling resumes along with copies of passports and visas to identity thieves. There are at least 20,000 fake scam agents like those above along with 10,000 “legitimate” agents who cause just as much grief and problems for FTs. Agents average 6-8 recruitment every month. For both species of recruiters, the foreign teacher represents low-hanging fruit for financial exploitation. While the scam agents profit from up-front fees and $300 per file to identity theft rings, the “legitimate” agent earns even more money in a most unethical and despicable fashion.

    The greedy agents place hundreds of free ads all over the internet offer fantastic teaching jobs in China that ostensibly offer $30,000 - $50,000 salaries, free housing, meals, healthcare insurance, paid vacations, bonuses, airfare reimbursements, visa support, and in some cases, even free Chinese lessons! For young university graduates in the West facing dismal job prospects in floundering economies, these “Work In China” ads seem like a timely blessing – a dream job. That’s the promise.

    China Scam Recruiters Lure Foreign Teachers With Hype & Lies - China Business Central - Open Salon

    ============================================

    China Foreign Teacher Wages Salary Pay & Earnings Facts - 2013

    79% of those polled said they would never have come to China if they knew what was waiting for them - unpaid overtime, unpaid wages, and an assortment of scams orchetsrated by shady agents and even their own employers

    China Foreign Teachers Exploited And Abused By Scams - China Business Central - Open Salon

    ============================================

    The link to this article is somewhat neutral. Although based on the underlined below, and the previous request for licensing information a caution flag needs to be raised.

    In recent days we have received over three dozen inquiries about New Life ESL - a fairly unknown recruiter that operates no office in China. China law mandates that placements of foreign workers in China done by recruiters/agents maintain a registered office in China.

    China Foreign Teacher News, Updates, & Scam Alerts

    ============================================


    "Learning from the mistakes of others is less costly than learning from your own" – J.P. Morgan

    https://chinascampatrol.wordpress.co...road-in-china/

    ============================================

    Without a doubt, foreign teachers in China are the biggest group of fraud victims--maybe not so much in terms of dollar value, but certainly in terms of volume. The China Foreign Teachers Union (yes there is one!) reports that approximately half of all foreign teachers in China have been swindled. There are 10 tricks used by agents and private schools to scam teachers. Here are a few of them.

    Scam Alert: The Foreign Teacher Fraud | City Weekend

    ============================================

    The following story was supplied to us by one of our readers, and serves as a warning to expats not to trust recruiters when looking for teaching jobs in China

    Chinese school recruiters scam expat teachers | China Daily Mail

    ============================================
    "It's virtually impossible to violate rules ... but it's impossible for a violation to go undetected, certainly not for a considerable period of time." Bernie Madoff
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Scam-...98399986981403

  7. #32
    Whip's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by Beacon View Post
    Ii.e. a signature and personal information on a CONTRACT you claimed they didn't require! You seem to be contradicting yourself.
    that was done long ago with the comment they don't go out of their way to review but somehow just happened to find this site for no reason.

  8. #33
    ribshaw's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    If you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us. Please do not contact the Embassy for help in finding employment or verifying the legitimacy of a school.


    Teaching English in China | Embassy of the United States Beijing, China

    American Citizen Services
    U.S. Embassy Beijing
    Tel: 86-10-8531-4000
    Fax: 86-10-8531-3300
    Email: BeijingACS@state.gov

    ==================================================

    VISA MATTERS

    Employment Visas

    Working legally in China requires a “Z” Visa from a Chinese embassy or consulate. The Z visa is the only valid work visa. Sponsorship from an employer is needed in order to obtain a Z visa. There have recent restrictions on visa issuance and renewals in China. See Beijing Municipal Public Security Bureau for more information about visa types and what information is required to obtain one.

    *Prospective teachers should also be aware that working in China on any type of visa other than the Z visa, such as a tourist “L” visa or student “F” or “X” visa, is illegal and can result in large fines or even detention.

    Required Documents

    Below is a list of the documents required to obtain a Z visa in the United States. Further information on obtaining a Z visa and a complete listing of the documents required is available on the website of the Chinese Embassy in the United States at The Embassy of the People's Republic of China in Washington, DC.

    - A valid US Passport with at least 6 months validity before the expiration date;
    - A visa notification issued by the authorized Chinese unit (your employer), and a “Work Permit for Aliens” issued by the Chinese Labor Ministry/”Foreign Expert’s License” issued by the Chinese Foreign Expert Bureau;
    - One completed Visa Application Form (Q1) with one additional passport photo;
    - Locally obtained health check for absence of HIV, TB, and drug use;
    - 50 US dollars.

    Foreign Teachers

    Foreign teachers are all teachers without an “Expert Certificate” from the National Expert Bureau of Foreign Affairs. In order to obtain a Resident Permit they will need to work with their employer to obtain the Foreign Teacher Resident Permit, colloquially known as the “Green Book” from their local Public Security Bureau. They will need the following documents.

    - Valid passport and visa;
    - Original “Health Certification” submitted by Beijing Exit & Entry Inspection & Quarantine Bureau;
    - Two recent, two-inch, bareheaded, full-faced photos (either black and white or in color);
    - The official seal of the unit (the employer, known as the “danwei”) on a filled-out “Application Form for Visa, Residence Permit,” along with one recent, two inch, bareheaded, full-faced photo.
    * For those working in Beijing whose work will not exceed one year, a temporary residence permit is available, and the “Health Certificate” is waived.

    ==================================================

    CONTRACTS

    Foreign instructors in China occasionally have contract disputes with their employers. Employees should be sure to get everything put into writing and not to rely on verbal promises. If possible one should receive an official copy of the contract before arriving in China, including a copy in Chinese. Even so, American teachers may find that Chinese contracts are not considered as binding as contracts in the United States. These contracts will sometimes contain unexpected alterations when the prospective teacher arrives, during the duration of their employment, or at the end of the period specified by the contract. Taking an employer to court over breach of contract is far less common in China than it is in the United States, and is a particularly difficult process for foreigners. Culturally, oral negotiation and a solid relationship with the employer are of paramount importance. A good working relationship with your school, institution, or business is vital to reaching an agreement over contractual difficulties.
    "It's virtually impossible to violate rules ... but it's impossible for a violation to go undetected, certainly not for a considerable period of time." Bernie Madoff
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Scam-...98399986981403

  9. #34
    nomaxim's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by Frankly My Dear... View Post
    Hey Derrick,

    I'm still waiting for you to answer my five questions above in blue.
    Well, it's only been a day or so.
    Hell, been waiting over a year for those 8 fake review website url's for CRCC from you.

    http://www.realscam.com/f8/beware-cr...401/#post56546;
    Quote Originally Posted by nomaxim View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankly My Dear... View Post
    but this CRCC group goes way out of its way to delete and hide all their complaints and the host 8 fake review sites that praise only themselves and find problems with all their competitors.
    And the url's for these 8 review sites are?
    I for one am beginning to believe those '8 fake review sites' don't exist.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

  10. #35
    nomaxim's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post
    I don't know about your definition of "sort of" but to me, the article is fairly clear:
    We have also ascertained that New Life ESL is not licensed nor authorized to do business in China and is not licensed in the State of Arizona as an employment agency. Their website Blog - New Life ESL went online in June of 2013. According to this link below, Mr. Yazwa had claimed to be registered in Hong Kong, but as of yesterday, there was no HK registration to be found for New Life ESL.
    Umm, wonder where they got that info from Arizona, LoL.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

  11. #36
    Seattle is offline Member
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    I started this thread focused on New Life ESL so will share with you an email reply I received from China Scam Patrol yesterday:

    "Thank you for your inquiry. You are not the first to be concerned about New Life ESL which our preliminary investigation reveals the following:

    * New Life ESL is an unregistered business entity in China with no rep office on record in any agency or ministry regulating foreign business operations in China. No records were found at SAFEA, SAIC, Ministry of Commerce, nor Ministry of Education.

    * The website www.newlifeesl.com went on line in June of 2013 and is registered to a Brendan Gibson of Mesa, Arizona.

    * New Life ESL is not licensed as an employment agency in the State of Arizona and no corporate records bear that business name.

    * Mr. Derrick Yazwa purports to be the owner/operator of this business. His personal public records are available on line for $49 at the links provided below.

    * The IRS has no taxpayer ID number and no Employer ID number assigned to any entity with the name of New Life ESL, and indication that no tax filings have been made of fiscal year 2013 as the filing deadline has passed.

    * The "testimonials" and reviews we found online are typical for "teach in china operations" and are mostly self-generated.

    * We have attempted to contact Mr. Yazwa to learn more about his online business but our efforts have been in vain and have been abandoned.


    If you want a complete due diligence report on this company/individual we can provide one within 10 days for a fee. In the interim, we would urge you to be extremely cautious and wary of New Life ESL at this time.

    In the future if you wish to check on a U.S.- based entity we suggest you start for free with tax and other public records shown here at
    5 Ways to Find a Federal Tax ID Number - wikiHow If you are checking out a China-based operation we suggest you check the various China blacklists and read this article explaining the Chinese licensing authority known as "SAIC" Finding An Honest Agent Or Recruiter In China - Mission Impossible? - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews

    We hope we have been helpful. Should you become a victim of any scam in China, please contact us with the details so we can help warn others who may fall into the same trap of which there are more than 380 at this time.

    Best Wishes,

    Jason
    Public Affairs Specialist
    China Scam Patrol"


    I think the above speaks for itself. Mr. Yazwa only needs to post his LLC registration link to establish some effort to legitimize himself and and explain why he operates illegally in China and advises his prospects to commit visa fraud that can get teachers arrested, fined, and deported with a five year reentry ban. He claims transparency on his website so I guess now is the time to step up and demonstrate that transparency. Derrick?

  12. #37
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Hi Guys,

    My name is Jordan Duncan. I’m teaching English in Suzhou right now. David Valley with China ESL is the recruiter I used and he has asked me to look at this post and a few others and talk to you about our my experience so far. Here is my facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/jordan.duncan.12935). Let me know if you need any other proof.

    I’ve read up on this thread and a few other’s in the past day or so. My experience with David has been very good so far. I have been in China for over 5 months and, so far, David has followed the contract to the letter. From what I’ve read, he has a pretty shitty reputation online and I wanted to at least add my 2 cents that he has been very good and straightforward with me. Before David showed me this thread, I had never heard the name 'New Life ESL.' I answered an ad for 'China ESL' and that is the company name David has used since we started.

    Please ask me anything you want to know and I’ll answer as fully as I can. I’ve only dealt with David over Skype and phone calls so far; I've never met him in person. I don’t know much about his business, his coworkers / employess or other teachers he has helped. If you have any specific questions or requests for myself or David, let me know. I will answer anything to the best of my knowledge and show you any documentation I have. I will pass along any requests to him.

    Jordan

  13. #38
    Whip's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    I will pass along any requests to him
    Why? He's already allegedly posted here so he knows where to look. As you can plainly see, he is dodging the real issues. We don't need a shill as an alleged go between.

  14. #39
    Beacon is offline Antiauthoritarian skeptic
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by aangthenomad View Post
    Hi Guys,

    My name is Jordan Duncan. Iím teaching English in Suzhou right now. David Valley with China ESL is the recruiter I used and he has asked me to look at this post and a few others and talk to you about our my experience so far. Here is my facebook page (https://www.facebook.com/jordan.duncan.12935). Let me know if you need any other proof.
    Jordan, thanks for your offer. In spite of the fact that I don't understand how David gave you the link to this page and can't answer anything for himself and that you by your own admission don't know naything about his business I will ask you a few questions about your post.

    1. Where in Suzhou are you teaching English?
    2. are there any other non native teachers there and any of which referred there by Davids company?
    3. While the selfie is a current internet craze why does the above facebook page have no pictures of you anywhere outdoors in China? It even has pictures of others taking selfies and lots of ex pats and chinese people outdoors but none of you. Why? Could you perhaps take one outside your school or at a local public building with the name in the background? That would constitute simple "proof" that you are at least in China. Should take you only a few minutes to walk outside and take a selfie. Or just ten seconds if you do it leaving the school.

    Iíve read up on this thread and a few otherís in the past day or so.
    4 Which other threads have you read?
    My experience with David has been very good so far. I have been in China for over 5 months
    5 How did you get to China? And when in china how did you get to your school and apartment?
    and, so far, David has followed the contract to the letter.
    6. Can you scan and reproduce the contract here? No need to put in your address which you can redact your name will suffice. Make sure the other party David or his company also appears. If you cant scan it should take 30 seconds to do if you photograph it with the camera you are using for your facebook page and the above selfie. Thanks.
    From what Iíve read, he has a pretty shitty reputation online and I wanted to at least add my 2 cents that he has been very good and straightforward with me.
    7. How? How has he been straigforward? You don't seem to know anything at all about China esl who owns it who works for it what their background and qualifications are etc.
    Before David showed me this thread, I had never heard the name 'New Life ESL.' I answered an ad for 'China ESL' and that is the company name David has used since we started.

    Please ask me anything you want to know and Iíll answer as fully as I can. Iíve only dealt with David over Skype and phone calls so far; I've never met him in person. I donít know much about his business, his coworkers / employess or other teachers he has helped. If you have any specific questions or requests for myself or David, let me know. I will answer anything to the best of my knowledge and show you any documentation I have. I will pass along any requests to him.

    Jordan
    8. Thanks Jordan can you answer the above and also add the background from 7 above?
    Could you also provide a list of all the "documentation" you have and Ill get back to you on what I want to see?

  15. #40
    Beacon is offline Antiauthoritarian skeptic
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by Whip View Post
    Why? He's already allegedly posted here so he knows where to look. As you can plainly see, he is dodging the real issues. We don't need a shill as an alleged go between.
    Speaking of "go betweens" and China ESL what do you make of this:
    http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2...11211668_2.htm

  16. #41
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    1. Where in Suzhou are you teaching English?
    I teach at an American early education school called Romp'N'Roll. We just opened the Suzhou center about 2 months ago. They have 3 or 4 centers in Beijing and something like 50 all across China. Romp'N'Roll has an American site and a Chinese site you can visit.

    2. are there any other non native teachers there and any of which referred there by Davids company?
    I'm the only foreign teacher at the Suzhou center, but Romp'N'Roll uses foreign teachers at all of their centers. I think the established centers usually have 2-3 foreign teachers. From what I understand, David and ChinaESL have a contract with Romp'N'Roll China. I think I may have been the first or one of the first teachers he placed with them. I don't know how many other teachers he has found for Romp'N'Roll. One of my Beijing friends has been with Romp'N'Roll for over 2 years and she told me the company recently decided to exclusively use agencies like ChinaESL to find their teachers. I'm not sure if ChinaESL is the only agency they use, but I would guess they have contracts with at least a few more companies like ChinaESL.

    3. While the selfie is a current internet craze why does the above facebook page have no pictures of you anywhere outdoors in China? It even has pictures of others taking selfies and lots of ex pats and chinese people outdoors but none of you. Why? Could you perhaps take one outside your school or at a local public building with the name in the background? That would constitute simple "proof" that you are at least in China. Should take you only a few minutes to walk outside and take a selfie. Or just ten seconds if you do it leaving the school.
    Gladly. I'm going to Hong Kong tomorrow for my Z visa but I will post a few pictures online when I get back.

    I don't have many pictures of myself outdoors in China because I almost always travel alone when I go to other cities. I don't really like the selfie thing, so I usually just take scenery pictures or shots of architecture I like. There should be at least a few pictures of me in Shanghai around mid June; I met some Portuguese tourists and spent a few days with them. We took some group shots around Shanghai and Suzhou.

    4 Which other threads have you read?
    The other two links David sent me were these:

    BEWARE CHINAESL--SCAM ALERT, Rebecca Tang will rip you off! | the Beijinger

    and

    David Valley Perpetuating China ESL Teacher Recruiting Scam - New Life ESL also suspect - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews

    I posted this same thing on thebeijinger thread but I didn't see any comment section or forum attached to the eslwatch article.

    5 How did you get to China? And when in china how did you get to your school and apartment?
    I flew to China and paid for my plane ticket. My contract lists a 7000RMB airfare bonus at the completion of a 1 year contract. When I arrived in Beijing, David arranged for a Chinese translator to meet me at the terminal and take me to a temporary apartment until they found something more permanent. I stayed there for about 3 days before they moved me to an apartment near the Llama Temple. (It was actually in the same building as the Entry and Exit Administration). The translator also helped me get setup with a Chinese cell phone, bank account and subway card, and took me to the train station to find my terminal etc when I moved to Suzhou.

    6. Can you scan and reproduce the contract here? No need to put in your address which you can redact your name will suffice. Make sure the other party David or his company also appears. If you cant scan it should take 30 seconds to do if you photograph it with the camera you are using for your facebook page and the above selfie. Thanks.
    I have a lot to do tonight getting ready for my Hong Kong trip tomorrow, but I will get the contract scanned and posted next week.

    7. How? How has he been straigforward? You don't seem to know anything at all about China esl who owns it who works for it what their background and qualifications are etc.
    He has been straightforward in that nothing he told me so far has been untrue. He has followed through with all the stipulations in our contract and has been very helpful. A few weeks after I arrived in Suzhou, I left my wallet in a taxi and wasn't able to get it back (I foolishly hadn't taken the taxi receipt). After I setup a new bank account, he advanced me 2000RMB from my first paycheck to hold me over.

    Frankly, I never thought to ask who owns his company or about his other employees. When you get a job in America, do you ask for the name of the CEO and your future coworkers before they hire you? It simply didn't occur to me. This was my first experience teaching in China. I had heard there were some scams and predatory agents, but I did my best to research the things I need and ask as many questions as I could. David was always very clear with me and never danced around any questions. I felt pretty safe going in and I have been careful not to let anyone take advantage of me and not to agree to anything that I'm not comfortable with.

    8. Thanks Jordan can you answer the above and also add the background from 7 above?
    Could you also provide a list of all the "documentation" you have and Ill get back to you on what I want to see?
    I think the contract is probably the only documentation I have. I know I have a copy of the contract before and after I signed it on my GoogleDrive, but maybe I can find something else that would be helpful. Is there anything specific I can provide? I'll look through my drive when I get back from Hong Kong and see what else I have.

  17. #42
    aangthenomad is offline Junior Member
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Well I just posted (or thought I did? Maybe I accidently closed the window on the 'Preview' screen...) a long response to all of your questions Beacon, but now I can't seem to find it on here or on my account history. Does this site have some kind of hidden delay for posting? As is, it's 10pm and I need to wake up at 7am to head to Shanghai and catch a plane to Hong Kong tomorrow. I will answer everything when I have more time later in the week. Sorry for the delay. Here are a few short answers until I have more time.

    1.) I work at a new Romp'N'Roll in Suzhou.
    ??????? - ???????????????
    https://www.rompnroll.com/

    2.) I am the only foreign teacher at my center but Romp'N'Roll uses foreign teachers in all of their centers. They have something like 50 centers across China. ChinaESL has a contract with Romp'N'Roll China to find teachers for them.

    3.) I don't like selfies and I travel alone, so I usually just take pictures of scenery and buildings. I will post some pictures of me at my center when I get back from Hong Kong.

    4.) BEWARE CHINAESL--SCAM ALERT, Rebecca Tang will rip you off! | the Beijinger

    David Valley Perpetuating China ESL Teacher Recruiting Scam - New Life ESL also suspect - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews


    5.) I paid for my plane ticket and will get a 7000RMB airfare bonus at the end of my contract. David had a translator meet me at the airport and take me to a temporary apartment when I arrived. She also helped me get a Chinese cellphone, a bank account and a subway card.

    6.) I will post my contract when i get back from Hong Kong.

    7.) Everything in my contract has been done so far. He hasn't lied to me or danced around any questions. I never asked about who owns his company or who else works there because it never occurred to me. When you get a job in America, do you ask about the CEO or your future coworkers? I just never really thought about it I guess.


    I need to get ready for my trip tomorrow, but I will post more when i get back to Suzhou. If the other post shows up, I'm sorry for this duplicate!

  18. #43
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Have a nice trip to Suzhou. Check back with us at the end of your contract with Rebecca who still has never explained why she had to change the name of her company 5 times in order to keep doing business in China and get ads posted online. FYI... "Total ESL" was one of her many aliases and take a look at this which I am cutting and pasting from eslcafe.com:

    My agent told me it was normal you work on an L visa during the "probationary period" when they recruited me under one of their many aliases "Total ESL" and within six months I was caught, arrested, fined and deported. They will say whatever you need to hear to sign a fricking contract. David Valley should be banned from China for telling people to break the law.

    Lately this Dave Valley fellow has claimed to be the new owner of China ESL (at eslwatch.info) and that all the problems below were the doing of one HR girl who he terminated. Unfortunately however, some of the below links go back to 2007! Lastly, today I checked with the Beijing SAIC licensing office and there is no "David Valley" name appearing on any China ESL registration files - only the original 2006 owner: Dr. Rebecca Tang.

    BEWARE CHINAESL--SCAM ALERT, Rebecca Tang will rip you off! | the Beijinger

    http://www.scam.com/showthread.php?t=609652

    http://www.eslbase.com/forum/viewtopic/t-3269

    [message deleted by author] | the Beijinger

    Beware China ESL (Rebecca Tang) & China-Tesol Foreign Teacher ESL/TEFL Scam Recruiters!

    httP://rebeccatangchinaesl.blogspot.com

    Job Discussion Forums :: View topic - ChinaESL, is this a real offer?

    ESL Jobs Forum - View topic - China ESL Scam - Rebecca Tang - Petition To Justice Minister

    http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2...11211668_2.htm

    China ESL & Rebecca Tang Changing Names - Use Blacklist For Info - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews

    Job Discussion Forums :: View topic - ChinaESL ???

    SCAM WARNING: Rebecca Tang, ChinaESL, RIP OFF - China School & Recruiter Review - ESL Jobs China

    Money Talks For Rebecca Tang & China ESL of Beijing - Scam! - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews

    https://newlifeeslscam.wordpress.com/

    Wolf Watch | Keeping The Sheep Safe 24/7

    Job Discussion Forums :: View topic - ChinaESL

    Do you know anything about Chinaesl? | the Beijinger

    http://www.thebeijinger.com/forum/20...xpat-web-sites

    China Teachers Alliance | Exposing China Foreign Teacher Scams

    The TEFL Blacklist

    SCAM ALERTS

    Keep your distance from Rebecca Tang, ChinaESL | the Beijinger

    International Scam Warning - China School & Recruiter Review - ESL Jobs China

    Last but not least, check out the illegal contract that China ESL uses to sign up teachers. This sucker is outrageous!

    Chinese School Principals Now Millionaires? - China Business Central - Open Salon

    Considering the above history of China ESL, I frankly must say that your comments are taken with a grain of salt. But hey, who knows maybe you will be the first happy customer of China ESL - paid or otherwise, it really doesn't matter at this point after so much expat carnage. Rebecca and David both belong behind bars without telephone or internet access or they will just keep scamming away.

  19. #44
    littleroundman is offline Administrator
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by aangthenomad
    Does this site have some kind of hidden delay
    It's part of the forum software anti spammer features.

    New members' first 5 posts are placed in a queue for moderation if they contain links or email addresses to prevent fly-by spammers filling the forum with their (usually badly) disguised referral links and/or links to malicious websites.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  20. #45
    Whip's Avatar
    Whip is offline Anonymous. As are you all
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Still trying to figure out why a shill is here and not the original scammer coming back and answering the real questions and providing the proof requested.

  21. #46
    Beacon is offline Antiauthoritarian skeptic
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by aangthenomad View Post
    I teach at an American early education school called Romp'N'Roll. We just opened the Suzhou center about 2 months ago. They have 3 or 4 centers in Beijing and something like 50 all across China. Romp'N'Roll has an American site ...
    .... From what I understand, David and ChinaESL have a contract with Romp'N'Roll China. ... One of my Beijing friends has been with Romp'N'Roll for over 2 years and she told me the company recently decided to exclusively use agencies like ChinaESL to find their teachers..
    That I find difficult to believe since the link you provided says they recruit directly.

    Teach in China | International Teaching Jobs at Romp n' Roll
    For immediate consideration, please forward your resume to Kate Troidl, Assistant Training Director, Romp n' Roll China.
    All Romp n' Roll locations in China are independently owned and operated franchisees of Beijing Rui You Ming Management & Consulting Co., Ltd
    I flew to China and paid for my plane ticket. My contract lists a 7000RMB airfare bonus at the completion of a 1 year contract.-
    Also odd since your above link says
    Will the company pay for my flight to China?
    Yes. The cost of the flight to China and the flight back to the United States after the one-year commitment has been satisfied is covered by Beijing Rui You Ming Management & Consulting Co., Ltd.
    That management company according to your own reference is the sole sub agent and ther is no question of "agencies like ESLChina" being used to recruit
    e have been changing the lives of children in the United States since 2004 and opened our first location in China in June 2010. Our locations in China are independently owned and operated under license by Beijing Rui You Ming Management & Consulting Co., Ltd.
    Which begs the question what was to stop you just applying directly to Rompnroll? I mean why was David or ChinaESL needed in the first place when anyone can just apply directly? Why should anyone bother using Valley?

    The US site is registered to Barnett, Michael
    Registrant Organization:
    Registrant Street: 5508 Bosworth Place
    Registrant City: Glen Allen
    Registrant State/Province: VA
    Registrant Postal Code: 23059

  22. #47
    aangthenomad is offline Junior Member
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    That I find difficult to believe since the link you provided says they recruit directly.
    David told me they had just signed the contract with Romp'N'Roll a week or two prior to my being hired, which was in March 2014. I know (from one of the senior teachers in Beijing) that before this contract, Romp'N'Roll had a policy of ONLY hiring directly. My guess is they simply haven't updated their website? Not sure on that one. You can always contract Romp'N'Roll directly and verify with them. I think (though I'm not sure, just guessing basically) that the reason Romp'N'Roll decided to use agencies is because it saves them a significant amount of time and money.

    I've heard stories of some of the terrible interviews the Beijing HQ had to deal with in the past and some of the travel expenses they had to swallow for completely worthless candidates. I think ChinaESL probably covers some of these costs now, and deals with the time consuming process of screening candidates before they get to China. When I arrived in Beijing, I only had 1 short interview with Romp'N'Roll before they told me to start training the next day. They had already seen almost all of my information via ChinaESL so the process was much easier.

    Also odd since your above link says "Will the company pay for my flight to China? Yes. The cost of the flight to China and the flight back to the United States after the one-year commitment has been satisfied is covered by Beijing Rui You Ming Management & Consulting Co., Ltd."
    Again, I'm pretty sure this information is old and outdated, although the process is the same with ChinaESL. The company doesn't pay for your flight; they REIMBURSE YOU for your flight AFTER you work for 1 full year. They aren't going to spend 600$ on every person that they want to interview, after all.

    That management company according to your own reference is the sole sub agent and ther is no question of "agencies like ESLChina" being used to recruit
    I have no idea what the 'Beijing Rui You Ming Management and Consulting Co' is or what they do. I know that ruiyouming305 was the wifi password at the Beijing headquarters, so they probably have something to do with staffing and setting up the offices in the Beijing centers. I'm completely guessing; you would have to contact Romp'N'Roll directly and ask them about it. You can find their contact information on their websites.

    But the sentence "Our locations in China are independently owned and operated under license by Beijing Rui You Ming Management & Consulting Co., Ltd." doesn't at all mean that Beijing Rui You Ming wouldn't use another company to find foreigner employees.

    If you are interested in contacting Romp'N'Roll China directly to verify anything I'm saying, here is the contact page from their website: Romp'N'Roll China Contact Info

    Here is a link to the specific center in Beijing that I trained at, called DaZhongSi (Google translates that as Beijing Bell Temple Center). This was always referred to as the 'Headquarters' so I think this is basically the homebase for all of Romp'N'Roll China.

    Beijing DaZhongSi Center

    Which begs the question what was to stop you just applying directly to Rompnroll? I mean why was David or ChinaESL needed in the first place when anyone can just apply directly? Why should anyone bother using Valley?
    There was nothing to stop me from simply applying to Romp'N'Roll directly. Before I talked to David, I had never heard of the company. But I most definitely could have contacted them directly after he told me about their Chinese schools and applied that way. I felt like that would have been a pretty dishonest and mean thing to do, after going through several skype interviews with David and having him help me through the process for a few weeks.

    Now that Romp'N'Roll China has changed their recruitment methods, it's possible they wouldn't allow someone to apply directly. There are several process they don't do anymore, like arranging visas, securing housing for teachers and tracking travel arrangements. My guess is that Romp'N'Roll would simply tell you to contact David or possibly another agency they do business with (I don't know if they use other agencies, but I would guess they use a few others).

    Personally, I'm glad I used an agency. It's been nice having a little extra piece of mind, knowing I have someone else in China that can help me in bad situations, like the aforementioned wallet-losing episode. It's also pretty nice for my job; the agency serves as a middle man between myself and the school, so they can help me get time off when I need it or deal with other issues at the school.

    I need to get back to work now and prepare a class for some babies. I uploaded a few pictures of the office here in Suzhou and from Hong Kong from my phone, but most are on my camera at home. I'll upload the rest to facebook tonite. Here is my Facebook profile again. https://www.facebook.com/jordan.duncan.12935

  23. #48
    Beacon is offline Antiauthoritarian skeptic
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by aangthenomad View Post
    David told me they had just signed the contract with Romp'N'Roll a week or two prior to my being hired, which was in March 2014. ... When I arrived in Beijing, I only had 1 short interview with Romp'N'Roll before they told me to start training the next day. They had already seen almost all of my information via ChinaESL so the process was much easier.
    ..

    Again, I'm pretty sure this information is old and outdated, although the process is the same with ChinaESL. The company doesn't pay for your flight; they REIMBURSE YOU for your flight AFTER you work for 1 full year. They aren't going to spend 600$ on every person that they want to interview, after all.
    ...

    There was nothing to stop me from simply applying to Romp'N'Roll directly. Before I talked to David, I had never heard of the company. But I most definitely could have contacted them directly after he told me about their Chinese schools and applied that way. I felt like that would have been a pretty dishonest and mean thing to do, after going through several skype interviews with David and having him help me through the process for a few weeks.
    From China - ESLwatch - Information, News and School Reviews

    " I charge no fees to place you with a teaching job." In realty the recruiter collects up to 50% of your intended salary direcctly from the school who will never tell you what your salary would have been had you applied directly since the Principal will collect a kick-back from the agent/recruiter.
    given you dont like dishonesty would you consider it dishonest if David is providing a service you don't need and is taking 50% of your salary for doing it?

    So what you can do is apply directly yourself (maybe under another name) or go to the HQ of the company and say you have a friend who wishes to apply and ask them what they pay. Dont go top your own school principal as he may be involved in the kick back payment.

    Then you can apply for a job with RompnRoll and terminate your contract with David and tell them they can keep the travel money and then you can have double your salary. I charge nothing for telling you this.

    Id suggest you correspond with www.ChinaForeignTeachersUnion.org

  24. #49
    nomaxim's Avatar
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by Beacon View Post
    Id suggest you correspond with www.ChinaForeignTeachersUnion.org
    I'd recommend caution with that website.

    For one, they have no contact information on their website. And the WhoIs shows a private registration with 'Domains by Proxy' on 26AUG2012. The website is not even two years old.
    ChinaForeignTeachersUnion.org WHOIS, DNS, & Domain Info - DomainTools
    Basically, no idea who runs that website.


    Per Alexa the websites traffic is almost non-existent.
    Note: It is hosted by Google in the US.
    The websites own 'blog achieve' shows a total of 27 articles posted since AUG2012, 26 of these were between AUG and DEC 2012.
    No articles were posted in 2013 and only one article was posted this year, in JAN.
    So the website has only been updated once in over a year and a half.
    It appears that the main website for this group is actually http://www.chinaforeignteachersunion.com.
    At least this is updated more often. Registered the same day as the .org website and also uses 'Domains by Proxy.
    GoDaddy WhoIs but has no traffic rating with Alexa.
    In fact, they have a interesting article at chinaforeignteachersunion.com/search/label/bj80.com about someone named 'Jordan' dated 11 days before a 'Jordan' posted here.



    Oddly, much of the information in regards to these matters is coming from websites(blogs) that were registered in late 2012 using 'Domains by Proxy' through GoDaddy and hosted by Google in Mountain View, CA.

    WhoIs for chinaforeignteachersunion.org registered 26AUG2012.
    WhoIs for chinaforeignteachersunion.com registered 26AUG2012.
    WhoIs for cleverchinacheaters.com registered 26AUG2012.
    WhoIs for chinascampatrol.org registered 7NOV2012
    WhoIs for chinascamcentral.com registered 19NOV2012.
    WhoIs for globalblacklist.org registered 27NOV2012.
    WhoIs for chinascambusters.com registered 16DEC2012.
    WhoIs for chinascampatrol.com registered 16DEC2012.

    IMO these websites are being operated by the same individual(s). These websites also often cross reference each other not only on their own sites but also at other blogs and forums as well, like here at RS. Basically, I consider any information from these websites to be from the same source.
    And who knows how many other websites they have.



    Perhaps a better recommendation for aangthenomad (Jordan) would be to just go to the nearest US Embassy for assistance.
    Or maybe the nearest police station and turn himself in as a possible illegal undocumented worker.
    The Chinese would most likely just deport him back to the US, after a period of questioning that is.

    PS
    I wouldn't be at all shocked if the CFTU .org website suddenly gets a bunch of new blog entries.
    Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge: it is those who know little, and not those who know much, who so positively assert that this or that problem will never be solved by science. -C. Darwin

  25. #50
    Beacon is offline Antiauthoritarian skeptic
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    Re: Rebecca's China ESL Scam Continues As New Life ESL With David Valley

    Quote Originally Posted by nomaxim View Post
    I'd recommend caution with that website.
    Ill stand corrected in my haste and should have reviewed them more. their legal and visa advice does I did wonder about them being the only union in communist China??

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