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Thread: The Devastating Effects of MLM

  1. #51
    Whip's Avatar
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Amen Heather

  2. #52
    OpenMindedSceptic is offline Junior Member
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    OMG! Did you hear about the roofing guy who claimed there was a 30 year warranty on labor and materials, then after only two years the roof started leaking and he was nowhere to be found! All roofers must be scam artists ... according to these stories.

    I am sorry to hear about these tragedies but using a paint bomb to smear all MLM businesses with them is just as despicable as those that caused the tragedies.

    First of all, the person that scammed these people was a scammer and the MLM company may not have been aware of it.
    Secondly not all MLM companies are the same and if a person did not do good research to see if the MLM is a member of the DSA and BBB with good standings, then they could be fooled.
    Thirdly, blaming all MLM entrepreneurs and all MLM companies because some scam artists bilked some people out of their savings is insulting to every Legitimate MLM with entrepreneurs who follow good codes of conduct.
    Lastly, if joining the MLM is based on an emotional decision after a hyped up motivational presentation followed by a selling frenzy, then it will likely be a sketchy line of sponsorship and possibly a sketchy company. If a person is pressured to sign anything without having time to learn more and get answers about the company and LOS, then that person should walk away ... or run ... or roll as is in my case!

    A good MLM should take the complaint of the high pressure sales tactics and large volume purchase "requirement", then ; Ask for the products to be return at the cost of the sponsor/salesman, refund the full cost of order and charge the sponsor/salesman for any discrepancies and possibly revoke their license/affiliation. I know of an MLM that has done this and even canceled large numbers of licenses/affiliates when an entire line of sponsorship was discovered to be acting outside their code of conduct rules. It was a significant loss of income but it was the right thing to do to stop bad conduct.

    I have also seen MLM companies that do not protect new business owners and pretend they don't know their lines of sponsorship are doing bad things because they are greedy and their shareholders are looking for dividends while the fad lasts. Most MLM companies with one or only a few products or gimmicks last less than 5 years. I know a major scam artist in my city that jumps on these as soon as he can, then moves his team to jump on and milks each one until it starts to wither then jumps ship and tells his team to jump, leaving chaos in their wake. He always makes the most but his team does well and don't care who gets hurt because they already made their money and got out before legal proceedings could take place and then claim they could tell something was wrong that is why they left. These are bad people doing bad things. When I discovered they were joining a venture I joined, I quit ASAP. Sure enough it was caught up and discovered to be sketchy, just not enough to shut down. I lost a bit but was well worth the lessons I learned and now know what to look for when approached by new ventures.

    If the name of the MLM is not listed and/or person who committed the scam is not listed, then I will consider the claim to be incredible. I am working with a very credible MLM company right now but know others who chose other MLM companies that reduced benefits or missed payments before shutting down with or without external enforcement. I would be happy to name the MLM I have as my distributor but suspect it would just get their good name painted with this distrust.

  3. #53
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Welcome to a complete idiot. Jack Weinzierl and Tim Darnell have dozens of threads here and across the net. Darnell ran numerous big ticket conference scams that had no retail sales. Weinzierl was his scammerr-in-chief. They sued me and the BBB and lost. 98% of the reps lost money and many were out 20 grand or more. They lost everything.

    MLM is a mth game and the vast majority are mathematically doomed to lose. Therefore all MLMs are scams. By all means, name the scam you promote and we will take a look ta the numbers. Then look at the scam that left Judy financially ruined and mentally and emotionally scarred.

  4. #54
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    @OpenMindedSkeptic

    Every legitimate multi-level marketing firm I have ever been aware of rips off retail consumers by attempting to sell them products at grossly inflated prices in order to generate the funds necessary to pay commissions back up the chain to the top of the sales pyramid. There are always unsubstantiated claims of higher quality in an attempt to justify the price.

    Illegitimate MLMs either assign value to a worthless (sometimes even imaginary) product, or spend the majority of their time selling the fantasy of quick wealth.

    SD

    .

  5. #55
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by shipdit View Post
    @OpenMindedSkeptic

    Every legitimate multi-level marketing firm I have ever been aware of rips off retail consumers by attempting to sell them products at grossly inflated prices in order to generate the funds necessary to pay commissions back up the chain to the top of the sales pyramid. There are always unsubstantiated claims of higher quality in an attempt to justify the price.
    I would echo this.


    There is always the "my MLM is different", it would be nice to see your product portfolio with prices. Affiliate attrition rates complete with income statistics using mean, median, and mode. I just looked at a COMPANY DOCUMENT yesterday and ALL of this was missing, imagine what goes on in the field.

    Self-Consumption is the hook, just buy it yourself and get others to do the same. People see so little value in the products they are offered almost a full 100% quit within a year or two, and by year five forget about it. If people who "own their own distribution business" can't even be convinced to buy their own paper towels, vitamins, super shakes, colon cleanse, and soap is there any wonder there is little to no true retail market?

    Let's take the other side of the one company I can think of that does have a large "retail" salesforce. There is almost no insurance company that a consumer could go to that does not have lower term insurance rates that Primerica. More than that is this, Life-Insurance Licensing Test Is Too Hard, Biased, Primerica Says - WSJ. What should that say to would be consumers? Then of course there is the whole make a list of your family and friends so we can show them the great opportunity you are involved with. Everyone loves Turkey Day that much more when a member of the family has something to sell.

    MLM has refused to clean up its own house for years on end.

    As for crooked roofers, I don't think anyone who posts here would stand for that either. Most roofers I know don't put a roof on your house, invite you to a meeting at the Ramada and then spend three hours claiming you too can be a roofer if you just buy a start up kit for $395, some RDPD books, and list 100 families you know that may have a roof.
    Last edited by ribshaw; 11-19-2014 at 10:56 AM.
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  6. #56
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic View Post
    OMG! Did you hear about the roofing guy who claimed there was a 30 year warranty on labor and materials, then after only two years the roof started leaking and he was nowhere to be found! All roofers must be scam artists ... according to these stories.
    NO, NO AND NO. "Openmindedsceptic's" entire post highlights why so many victims are lured in. The thought process is all wrong and one of the biggest mistakes people make regarding MLM - It's a mindset that has been purposely orchestrated by MLM founders and refined to a point where even high achievers have been duped.

    "Labor and materials"

    The roofer's method of installing the shingles was flawed not the shingles. All roofers who used his method would in fact be shoddy roofers/scammers even if they used a different brand of shingle.

    "Distribution and product"

    The affiliate's method of distributing product is MLM. The product is insignificant if the method/system is flawed. An inferior product just makes it worse.

    Fact is, MLM is inherently flawed which explains the near 100% failure rate. Specifics can be found in other posts.

    If only more people could comprehend this!

    SBM you're an amazing friend STILL.

  7. #57
    OpenMindedSceptic is offline Junior Member
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by Char View Post
    ...
    Fact is, MLM is inherently flawed which explains the near 100% failure rate. Specifics can be found in other posts.

    If only more people could comprehend this!
    ...
    That is just stupid and there is no cure for it. >.<

    100% of the people who quit, fail.

    In one MLM, thousands of people have become debt free and hundreds have replaced their income. I am friends with a number of people who have helped dozens of singles and couples get debt free and replace at least one income. Not a single one of these people had special skills or affiliations before they started at $0 but every one followed the plan and those that tried harder succeeded quicker. Not everybody has the will to change their broken mindset in order to become an entrepreneur and that is all it takes. Show me one person who failed in an MLM who is successful as an entrepreneur in a non MLM field and I will show you someone who is concerned more about themselves than others.

    If the only people on here are idiots who have nothing better to do than display their ignorance, this is the wrong site for me.

  8. #58
    littleroundman is offline Administrator
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic
    this is the wrong site for me.
    If you are prone to making statements like that - there's not much doubt you're right.

    CYA and a very Merry Christmas to you and yours.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  9. #59
    kath is offline Senior Member
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    i would say that "openmindedskeptic" showed the true agenda they had all along--pro mlm period which would seem to make their moniker a huge oxymoron- anything BUT open minded or skeptical!
    and lets not forget all the devastated broken relationships these mlm scam artists leave in their wake!

  10. #60
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic
    100% of the people who quit, fail.
    100% of people who DON't quit trying to climb Mt Everest in their underpants die.

    "Quitting"
    trying to do something you've been lied to about isn't "quitting" at all, it''s facing reality, free from the influence and Jedi mind tricks of trained recruiters.

    How did it come about that so many millions of MLM recruits all have the same misguided belief about how easy it is / would be to earn squillions of dollars in multi level marketing if they hadn't been told by someone ???

    If "following the plan" is a guarantee of success, why is it Amway IBOs dropped that spiel years ago ??

    If the companies and / or recruiters involved had been open, honest and transparent, would there be 1) as many recruits 2) as many disappointed recruits 3) as many dropouts

    Osmosis ????

    The hundredth monkey theory ??
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  11. #61
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic View Post

    100% of the people who quit, fail.
    It's unfortunate that MLM'rz never seem able to engage in any conversation beyond "happy talk motivational platitudes". People who DON"T QUIT a bad situation if they can are IDIOTS. In my early teens I washed dishes and scrubbed toilets, following your logic I failed since I quit, several times. Like any rational person I looked at my current situation and once I could trade up I did, several times.

    Your quote misses the bigger point that MLM is often pitched as 10 hours a week with full time income just buying from yourself--oh and show two others to do the same. Tell your recruits that greater than 99% will lose money after time and expenses then let's see how many bother to start.

    MLM Less than one percent make money.JPG

    Shocking MLM statistics


    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic View Post

    In one MLM, thousands of people have become debt free and hundreds have replaced their income. I am friends with a number of people who have helped dozens of singles and couples get debt free and replace at least one income.

    AGAIN YOU SAY. Where are the numbers? One thing that jumped out right away is you claim you "have friends who have helped", not YOU HAVE HELPED. That is a huge difference if for no other reason than it does not disclose your income, or provide the veracity of second hand stories. If you sold How to Win the Lottery courses on the web to 100,000 people, no doubt you could find a few hundred that cash tickets for middling amounts. If you sold 20,00,000 courses every year eventually you could find someone who won a massive jackpot. Following your logic it is reasonable to point to that small group of people and say see how well my system works. Just don't quit playing the lottery and you will never be a loser.

    Complete disregard for the 99% that make no money after T&E. In a "good" MLM maybe that gets as low as 95%, where 4% make around minimum wage after T&E.


    ================================================== ===========

    As if not making money in MLM is not bad enough. Affiliates are often convinced they need to run up debt, lease expensive cars, wear fancy clothes and accessories that give the air of success. This is a double whammy for many. Rather than making cash immediately and being able to bank it or pay down debt, often MLM'erz spend years on a dream, and end up 1000$ in debt.

    But what about the LEADERS that are often trotted out on stage as if they were gods? Let's just say I don't believe anything money without independently audited financial statements. But if you take it on the sound of some upbeat music and a few speed boat videos, well it is a free country.


    Amway Triple Diamond Bankrupt

    Married to an Ambot: Amway Diamonds Are Broke

    The Salty Droid – The Burton Affairs

    Michael Burton | Herbalife Pyramid Scheme


    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic View Post
    Not a single one of these people had special skills or affiliations before they started at $0 but every one followed the plan and those that tried harder succeeded quicker. Not everybody has the will to change their broken mindset in order to become an entrepreneur and that is all it takes.
    Motivational Claptrap.

    Almost everyone has their own X factor(s) that gives them success in one area and failure in others. There are a whole host of things I personally can't do and I hardly think that is a broken mindset. I could stand and practice free throws every day for the rest of my life and would be lucky to qualify for a JV team.

    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic View Post
    Show me one person who failed in an MLM who is successful as an entrepreneur in a non MLM field and I will show you someone who is concerned more about themselves than others.
    MLM "success" is predicated on getting 99% of the people below you to buy as much crap from you as possible. Ask Dexter Yeager http://www.ex-cult.org/Groups/Amway/dexter-yager-2.txt why he set up his own motivational tool publishing business.

    Again, would be happy to look at some verifiable retail numbers from your MLM, but I suspect being concerned with others may mean something different to you and I.

    Quote Originally Posted by OpenMindedSceptic View Post
    If the only people on here are idiots who have nothing better to do than display their ignorance, this is the wrong site for me.
    This may or may not be the wrong site for you, seems like someone blew a lot of smoke up your ass about MLM. Maybe if you actually put up the hard numbers, and stopped with the Tony Robbins you might see what you are up against. Then again maybe you are knocking back 6 FIG$ and curing cancer with your latest multivitamin.

    For the casual reader, when a "friend" from high school calls out of the blue to discuss an "opportunity", well I suppose that is who this site serves. Will it prompt them to ask hard questions and demand data? Or will they think "they have a poster of an eagle with a fish in its mouth", this must be a great opportunity?
    Last edited by ribshaw; 11-20-2014 at 11:00 AM.
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  12. #62
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Not a single one of these people had special skills or affiliations before they started at $0 but every one followed the plan and those that tried harder succeeded quicker. Not everybody has the will to change their broken mindset in order to become an entrepreneur and that is all it takes.
    you will never get me to buy overpriced mlm crap. you have failed. see how that works?

  13. #63
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by Ribshaw
    As if not making money in MLM is not bad enough. Affiliates are often convinced they need to run up debt, lease expensive cars, wear fancy clothes and accessories that give the air of success.
    Ah yes, the old "Fake it till you make it" MLMers' mantra in action.

    Translated into English it reads "If you can't be successful in MLM, at least make it look like you are"
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Today is the 6th anniversary of Judy S' suicide.

    Ecclesiastes 12:12-14 ESV / 15 helpful votes

    .... Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. For God will bring every deed into judgment, with every secret thing, whether good or evil.

    Hebrews 4:13 ESV / 14 helpful votes

    And no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account.

    John 3:19-21 ESV / 8 helpful votes

    And this is the judgment: the light has come into the world, and people loved the darkness rather than the light because their works were evil. For everyone who does wicked things hates the light and does not come to the light, lest his works should be exposed. But whoever does what is true comes to the light, so that it may be clearly seen that his works have been carried out in God.
    We will never forget. Those who ruined her financially and destroyed so many other lives will face Judgment Day!


    But no mercy or rest for the wicked!

  15. #65
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    Re: The Devastating Effects of MLM

    Quote Originally Posted by Soapboxmom View Post


    Today is the fourth anniversary of Judy leaving us. I will never forget. Jack Weinzierl and Tim Darnell have Judy's blood on their hands. God bless our Judy and all the victims of financial fraud. I will continue to devote my life to exposing the scammers responsible for this horrific devastation.
    Congratulations for your stand against the perpetrators of these cons Heather.

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