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Thread: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

  1. #51
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by GlimDropper View Post
    And a special thank you to you too for posting that okosh.
    Always happy to help out any way I can
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  2. #52
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by EagleOne View Post
    LRM: You mean you don't care that I got banned at TG? I'm crushed!
    HeHeHe,

    I'd say if being banned from Talkgold is the worst thing that happens to you in 2011, then you're in for a bloody good year.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  3. #53
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Needham Notes:

    Not all too much of this is all that interesting but I'm posting it to keep anyone else from needing to redo any of the same digging. All told, after someone convicts Hank and locks him up for a very long time, I want to be his pen pal. He must know more of the back stories on many of the early internet scams than most anyone I know.

    1999:

    Two websites, mailtrail.com and Caltek.com (the links are to archive.org indexes for the sites). Mail Trial was an early auto responder system which seems to have had some commercial viability. It also had an affiliate program which by today's standards is pretty squeaky clean but it does show Hank's exuberance with numbers:

    Referral Program & Income Calculator
    GET OTHERS TO MAKE MONEY FOR YOU

    FREE TO JOIN!


    HOW?
    Introduce OTHER Agents for FREE by either placing a banner on your Web Site, tell a few friends or e-mail your contacts with a link to your MailTrail Page. Each time someone clicks on it, they will be transferred to YOUR FREE MailTrail Web Site. When they join as a Customer - YOU EARN 20% per year of their yearly fees. When they join as an Agent (FREE) - you increase your Marketing POWER and so on....

    WHAT HAPPENS IF THEY INTRODUCE SOMEONE?
    Each time one of Your Referrals (Customers or Agents) introduces a Customer, you receive 10% per year of their yearly fees, and so on, through a total of FOUR LEVELS. AND your MailTrail Marketing POWER geometrically progresses.



    Example:
    Say YOU INTRODUCE 10 agents and each of those introduce 10 and so on...(10 agents should be easy when the agency is free). (10

    10 Your agents 100 Agents in Level 2 1000 Agents in Level 3 10000 Agents in Level 4 100,000 Agents in Level 5 111,110 Total agents in your business Assume that each agent has a minimum of 10 visitors to their page every week, or 40 per month. This means that you have
    111,110 x 40 = 4,444,400 (nearly 4.5 Million) adverts being shown for YOUR Mailtrail Business EVERY Month.

    If we apply industry standards to this and say only 1% of people click on the advert and only 1% of these people actually join as customers then you should get nearly 450 NEW CUSTOMERS every month and earn over 1300 ($2000) a month.
    Remember, this business is FREE TO JOIN and it is Global. Customers pay ONLY 30 PER ANNUM for a service that other companies sell for 5 Times that amount. Therefore, Large Profits are VERY REAL. Don't forget 10,000 new people every day join the internet.
    In April of 06 the site changes to a capture page for MyCashExchange and seems to go dark in December of 07.

    Caltek.com is a bit more convoluted. It starts in January of 1999 as the website of Axicom Communications Group and it doesn't seem that Hank was involved. But the domain seems to have changed and in September of 02 it begins hawking something called a "Heart Bar." While I somehow doubt, as Hank claimed the Heart Bar was both safe and effective in treating "cardiovascular disease" it's an ironic note, this was probably the best investment opportunity he ever promoted. United Therapeutics (NASDAQ UTHR), makers of the heart bar were selling for about $6 a share back them, it's close to $70 a share now and split 2 for 1 in that time.

    In November of 02 Hank starts selling a "No Money Down" real estate investing seminar on CDs. I don't know what the real estate market in the UK is like but on this side of the pond "no money down" is the mating call of the North American seminar scam artist. But did Hank's seminar (on CDs) have an affiliate program, you betcha. Hank's No Cash Down site had a good run, all the way to September of 05 when Caltek.com transforms it's self into Surf City.

    September of 2005 Hank Needham begins promoting ponzi schemes in earnest. Starting with Studio Traffic (user name: Hanee). By December Studio Traffic is still being pimped but MutualAutoSurf.com (ref:51472) and Fortune500Surf.com (ref:1041) are added.

    I'm tempted to think the Christmas blahs hurt Surf programs then as it does now because January of 06 finds caltek.com being used to sell a 1992 TOTOYA HILUX (and that's how he spelled it). February saw a return to the surf scene with the classic 12DailyPro (ref:54037) and one I'd never heard of before, PixMeUp (user name: Hanee). It also saw his first mention of another of his sites, FreeAutoBot.com. April and May of 06 the surfs are gone and it's just a pitch for free autobot.

    June 06 coincides with the launch on Hank's own surf ponzi MyCashExchange.com so he stops advertising his competitors and caltek.com starts selling some sort of ATM card you can transfer E-Gold into cash with "anonymously." Just by happy coincidence you can launder your MCE "advertising credits" ($AC) with the same card. It's fairly plain he didn't stop playing other ponzis, he just didn't advertise them on his site.

    August of 06 starts a major blitz of selling the Prosperity Automated Systems (PAS). If you bought into Hanks downline he'd accept $AC's for half of your buy in fee. Such a generous guy with his own funny money. About this time he debuts the term "ProTeamInternational" as the predecessor of his
    "Prosperity Team International," Hank knows one of the key's to marketing greatness is branding. The PAS system is still being actively flogged at least through November (and perhaps into December, Archive.org is a bit glitchy tonight) which I find just a wee bit ironic. Because in September of that year SEC began litigation shutting Prosperity Automated Systems down. I guess it took a while for Hank to hear the news.

    From January 07 on Caltek was just used to sell MCE and as a sign up page for Hank Needham's newsletter of "proven" money making programs. Now it just redirects to camuda.com.

    OK, that's Needham Notes for this evening. He has more URLs and one of these days I'll have more time.

    [Next time on Needham Notes: The name Club Asteria is his invention. Look at the banner on his PTIPower.com site from December of 07.]




    Last edited by GlimDropper; 01-27-2011 at 11:10 PM.
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  4. #54
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by GlimDropper
    Not all too much of this is all that interesting but I'm posting it to keep anyone else from needing to redo any of the same digging.
    That's one thing we can disagree about.

    I find it not only interesting, but fascinating.

    None of these online frauds consist of a single untruth.

    Much like an onion, they are layer upon layer of separate but interlinked skins.

    I truly believe that the secret to bringing the worst of these fraudsters to justice lies in the ability of like minded individuals carefully peeling apart those layers, then providing the gathered information in usable fashion to someone who CAN prosecute.

    Simpler said than done, I know, but I CAN forsee the day when a focused group of individuals can cultivate such a mutually beneficial relationship with one of the LE agencies.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  5. #55
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    GAME OVER!!!!....This one is all but done....

    On the down side this usually means that the Feds are sleeping and that the scammers behind this one will get away with it

    The latest update....
    Withdrawals
    Requests for withdrawals from your Cash Balance will be conducted in a timely manner. Please allow up to 10 business days for processing and receipt of your money. This depends upon your chosen method of withdrawal. There will not be any withdrawal requests processed on Saturday, Sunday or Holidays. We only process withdrawals in excess of $25.

    You need to request withdrawals from your account on CLUB-ASTERIA's website.
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  6. #56
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    I suppose the upside, if there is one, is that this one hasn't been running long enough to have taken in any serious money or roped in many non HYIP ponzi players.

    It's as likely that Club Asteria has 100,000 members as it is that TheExtortionBuster has a Degree in economics.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  7. #57
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post
    I suppose the upside, if there is one, is that this one hasn't been running long enough to have taken in any serious money or roped in many non HYIP ponzi players.

    It's as likely that Club Asteria has 100,000 members as it is that TheExtortionBuster has a Degree in economics.
    I have to disagree with that point....
    If you visit the "view all users" page there are just so many from places like Asia and India...This one spread like wild fire through those parts and this would have introduced a whole lot of newbs to the scam scene....
    One can only hope the newbs lost money here and then maybe they will make this one their first and last scam....

    As for the 100,000 members well that is real....What they don't tell you is how many of the 100,000 actually deposited money....I'm guessing that number is much less...
    Even if it's only half that deposited that makes this one big by today's standards....

    I wish it just close up and not drag on like it plans to....
    Ken Russo posted that his newest sucker is "ID 110252"....
    Hit the sign up button in a week or a month and I'll bet that number continues to rise as even more get suckered into this one even though they have zero chance of making profit....
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  8. #58
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Consider me corrected.

    Having said that, I STILL don't think it's possible for Buster to have anything but a degree in "stupid"
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  9. #59
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    The weekly "commission" is down to 6.25% which means, if I can trust the spreadsheet on one of Hank's sites, it would take 53 weeks for a new gold member to brake even in C-A. Which also means someone with 20,000 Asterios is now only earning $250/week. When it was "sustaining" 10% payouts the break even point was 33 only weeks. They're even capping Network Directors at $25,000 a month (plus their standard rev share). I wonder how many "Directors" will be affected by the limits? My guess is very few if not none, anyone with enough of a downline to bring in that level of commissions probably has side deals in place so isn't really on the books so to speak anyway.

    One point from the latest news release I don't quite understand however:
    In addition, the matching bonus has been a wonderful blessing and gift to all of us, but it creates a burden in being able to keep up the high percentage of revenue sharing. We are happy to confirm that the 100% matching bonus for sales of $250 and above will continue throughout the month of February. Effective immediately there will be a maximum of 3000 Asterios in total matching bonus that a member can receive. On March 1st, we will be announcing any other changes to the matching bonus based on a thorough study of its benefits and costs.
    If I'm reading that right it means that no (non director) member has any motive for spending more than $1,500 for Asterios outside of their monthly fee. it strikes me funny that they'd deprive anyone of an excuse to hand them cash. Unless,.....Hmmm. At the current 6.25% if you join at $20/month and buy 3,000 asterios (for $1,500 in week 1) you actually start taking more money out of the system than you put in at week 24. So they do go into deficit on you 31 weeks sooner. But the way the numbers work if you bought 5,000 asterios ($2,500) the break even date is in week 17, is that enough of a difference to justify not accepting an extra grand?

    I don't care how you slice it, C-A is doing the ponzi scheme dance of death, if you have moderator warning points to spare over at TG, now's the time to wager them. I put Hank's C-A excel sheet into a zip file and it should be attached to this post in case anyone wants to play with the numbers.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  10. #60
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by GlimDropper View Post

    One point from the latest news release I don't quite understand however:


    If I'm reading that right it means that no (non director) member has any motive for spending more than $1,500 for Asterios outside of their monthly fee. it strikes me funny that they'd deprive anyone of an excuse to hand them cash. Unless,.....Hmmm. At the current 6.25% if you join at $20/month and buy 3,000 asterios (for $1,500 in week 1) you actually start taking more money out of the system than you put in at week 24. So they do go into deficit on you 31 weeks sooner. But the way the numbers work if you bought 5,000 asterios ($2,500) the break even date is in week 17, is that enough of a difference to justify not accepting an extra grand?
    Looks to me like they want a lot of suckers to spend a little rather then a few suckers to spend a lot....
    The idea being that this may give them a better chance of continuing to find more fresh suckers to join which in turn could slow the process of the ponzi imploding....

    Reality though is that all they are doing is rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic....
    But it's an interesting tactic on their part.....
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  11. #61
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Anyone else noticed the definite slowdown of the Club Asteria thread on Talkgold ????

    Only the 2 or 3 hardcore cheerleaders are posting there now and, even then, there's up to 4 hour gaps between posts.

    A situation which can only get worse now that Manolo has a temp. ban.

    I wouldn't mind betting the usual suspect "playas" are long gone.

    The only question remaining now is whether they will they use a "bang" or a "whimper" exit strategy.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  12. #62
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post
    Anyone else noticed the definite slowdown of the Club Asteria thread on Talkgold ????

    Only the 2 or 3 hardcore cheerleaders are posting there now and, even then, there's up to 4 hour gaps between posts.

    A situation which can only get worse now that Manolo has a temp. ban.

    I wouldn't mind betting the usual suspect "playas" are long gone.

    The only question remaining now is whether they will they use a "bang" or a "whimper" exit strategy.
    "Manolo"....That would be Dirson E. Jimenez Santana who posts as "strosdegoz" on MMG....
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  13. #63
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Golly, gee, whiz,

    14 hours between posts in the Club Asteria thread on Talkgold, even then, the only reason for posting is for a CA memberto complain the CA website is STILL down.

    Methinks, even having that renowned HYIP ponzi shill, the Extortion Buster in Ms Lucas' corner isn't gonna save this HYIP ponzi games' end from happening sooner, rather than later.

    Poor young Buster and his sidekick Jenaya,

    they really, really thought they were on such a roll,

    Bang or whimper, whimper or bang.
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  14. #64
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by okosh View Post
    "Manolo"....That would be Dirson E. Jimenez Santana who posts as "strosdegoz" on MMG....
    I'd say "manolo" has probably 2 or 3 good shill jobs left in him before even the newest newbie wakes up and realizes that if "manolo" is shilling for a HYIP, the end is near and it's time to run for the hills.

    It can't be too long now before we all hold hands and launch into a rousing rendition of:

    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  15. #65
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by littleroundman View Post
    I'd say "manolo" has probably 2 or 3 good shill jobs left in him before even the newest newbie wakes up and realizes that if "manolo" is shilling for a HYIP, the end is near and it's time to run for the hills.
    Naaaaa....Manolo is under the tutelage of one Ken Russo....He'll teach him how to shill for years and have the sheep follow him from scam to scam....

    Also worth noting that despite Ken having moved on from the TG thread he is still bringing in new suckers on an almost daily basis....

    You may have to log in to read but this is where Ken directs all all his sheep to get their info from him ....
    Log in
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  16. #66
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by okosh View Post
    Naaaaa....Manolo is under the tutelage of one Ken Russo....He'll teach him how to shill for years and have the sheep follow him from scam to scam....

    Also worth noting that despite Ken having moved on from the TG thread he is still bringing in new suckers on an almost daily basis....

    You may have to log in to read but this is where Ken directs all all his sheep to get their info from him ....
    Log in
    Manolo? You mean Dirson E. Jimenez Satana, er. Santana? Say it ain't so. He seems so genuine and concerned in all his e-mails to me. The fact that the pimps need their e-mail lists makes them very easy to track, hell I doubt they'd even notice if you fed CFR2008A@ConsumerFraudReporting.org into one of their lists. But that's probably not a good idea, sorry I even mentioned it.

    That's a nice little forum link Okosh, they don't even verify by e-mail so as long as you can remember your account details you can read over there all you like. One interesting comment from good old Ken, on January 20th he was proud to announce that he had just become a "Network Director" but five days prior to that he posted his "payment proof" for his network director commission for the month of December. Oh well, no one who knows him expects him to be honest, or to keep his lies straight.
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  17. #67
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Here's a question that Buster or perhaps Jenaya can answer, if anyone cares enough to ask either of them:

    If 10 X 0 = 0

    Does that mean being a "network director" of a the deceased Club Asteria HYIP ponzi game is also worth 0 ???

    And 10 "network directors" = 0

    Come to think of it, I vaguely remember someone wrote a song about what it means to be the "network director" of a HYIP ponzi game:

    What was that song ???

    Ah, yes:

    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  18. #68
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by GlimDropper View Post
    Manolo? You mean Dirson E. Jimenez Satana, er. Santana? Say it ain't so. He seems so genuine and concerned in all his e-mails to me.
    Would you like his home address and phone number as well

    Courtesy of GoDaddy whois....

    Administrative Contact:
    Jimenez Santana, Dirson Eduardo alandetsu@gmail.com
    calle las caobas esq. fuller
    condominio la villa, p7
    Bayahibe, Higuey 809
    Dominican Republic
    (809) 702-3600
    http://who.godaddy.com/whois.aspx?do...rog_id=GoDaddy

    The fact that the pimps need their e-mail lists makes them very easy to track, hell I doubt they'd even notice if you fed CFR2008A@ConsumerFraudReporting.org into one of their lists. But that's probably not a good idea, sorry I even mentioned it.
    It's a great idea...Consider it done
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

  19. #69
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Well it seems ken Russo has survived his latest scare....Was lucky the paramedics were on hand to give him oxygen....

    It all started when Ken logged into his club asteria account and found that the button to all his referals was gone....
    He nearly fainted from the shock....

    After a nervous call to CA support regarding his referals he found out that they will all be back in his account when CA moves to the new software which is expected to take place on wednesday....

    Wonder if he realises that they never said which wednesday
    ʎɐqǝ uo pɹɐoqʎǝʞ ɐ ʎnq ı ǝɯıʇ ʇsɐן ǝɥʇ sı sıɥʇ

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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Hmmnn,

    Only 2 posts in the Talkgold Club Asteria thread in the past 36 hours, and one of them was the post by SUPERshill, Ken Russo noted above by okosh.

    HARK !!!!

    Is that the pitter patter of tiny HYIP ponzi playa feet I hear disappearing into the distance ????

    Or, is it perhaps the sound the sound of weeping and wailing and gnashing of ExtortionBuster and Jenaya teeth ???



    bang or whimper, whimper or bang ???
    The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing

  21. #71
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    OMG...! Is this P2P Deja Vu...?

    Remembering the slow site and disabling features and moving to new servers....!
    Wonder why they haven't purged the free members yet?

  22. #72
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Blogger Patrick Pretty, a man who holds my greatest respect wrote an article today touching on Club-Asteria and those pimping the program. Drawing specific attention to the TalkGold forum and it's role in facilitating so called programs like C-A and making some suggestions for how the government might appropriately reply to these issues. I'm pleased to be able to direct your attention to his blog.
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  23. #73
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by laidback View Post
    OMG...! Is this P2P Deja Vu...?

    Remembering the slow site and disabling features and moving to new servers....!
    Wonder why they haven't purged the free members yet?
    If they did, their membership role would drop by close to 60%. They can't have that. They need the illusion they are a successful and growing entity. It is all smoke and mirrors with them. This is why they are in financial trouble. Not enough "paying member" to keep it going much longer. It is why the return % paid has dropped significantly in the past week.

  24. #74
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Fairly trivial but a though occurred to me. I'd been looking at the cash flow numbers from the individual user break even perspective. At the current 6.25%/week return it takes 53 weeks for a passive gold member to break even for example. But the numbers look very different from C-A's perspective. When you join as a gold member you pay $19.95/month but $9 of that goes to the person who recruited you. The network directors get commissions in addition to that but the numbers there are too opaque to be cleanly factored. But it is safe to say that while a passive gold member breaks even in 53 weeks (at current return rates) the company actually starts losing money on that same gold member in under 37 weeks.

    Back when Ad Surf Daily was a hot topic there used to poster at Patrick's (and at other places) going by the name Entertained, there wouldn't happen to be anyone here he owes a favor to that I could barter with? He was better than anyone I can think of with mathematical modeling and I'm coming close to thinking we have access to enough data to predict the specific growth rate required to sustain C-A. Within a margin of error to be sure but provided with the correct formulas, and someone either patient enough to or wielding a heavy enough stone to get them through my skull, we stand a chance of having a clearer notion of when this house of cards will fall then Kenny boy and his pimps.

    A fools errand perhaps but that's all you'll get from me tonight, I'm going down the drinker. If you're posting in this thread tomorrow morning, please type softly. :)
    So your prophets of finance have fallen on their collective proverbial face, and you hear muffled voices calling: Welcome to the human race.
    You made a killing dealing real estate at NASA selling cemetery plots in outer space til some falling coffins crashed upon your doorstep: Welcome to the human race.

    Open up your heart...

    Welcome to RealScam.com.

  25. #75
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    Re: Club Asteria - club-asteria.com

    Quote Originally Posted by GlimDropper View Post
    Fairly trivial but a though occurred to me. I'd been looking at the cash flow numbers from the individual user break even perspective. At the current 6.25%/week return it takes 53 weeks for a passive gold member to break even for example. But the numbers look very different from C-A's perspective. When you join as a gold member you pay $19.95/month but $9 of that goes to the person who recruited you. The network directors get commissions in addition to that but the numbers there are too opaque to be cleanly factored. But it is safe to say that while a passive gold member breaks even in 53 weeks (at current return rates) the company actually starts losing money on that same gold member in under 37 weeks.

    Back when Ad Surf Daily was a hot topic there used to poster at Patrick's (and at other places) going by the name Entertained, there wouldn't happen to be anyone here he owes a favor to that I could barter with? He was better than anyone I can think of with mathematical modeling and I'm coming close to thinking we have access to enough data to predict the specific growth rate required to sustain C-A. Within a margin of error to be sure but provided with the correct formulas, and someone either patient enough to or wielding a heavy enough stone to get them through my skull, we stand a chance of having a clearer notion of when this house of cards will fall then Kenny boy and his pimps.

    A fools errand perhaps but that's all you'll get from me tonight, I'm going down the drinker. If you're posting in this thread tomorrow morning, please type softly. :)
    GD: Sent him an invitation to join us here and answer your questions. Hopefully he will accept and join us.

    Did I type quietly enough?

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