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Thread: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

  1. #26
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by USANAWatchDog View Post
    I am the one to uncover and post on the internet the information about Len Clement's USANA distributorship deal. If you have any specific questions regarding Len's USANA relationship, I can provide lots of answers. Most of this was discussed on the Scam.com forum, which apparently is gone forever now.
    Do you know then, when Lenny really hooked up with them as opposed to when it was "announced"? When was he actually brought on board? How long was he in discussions with Usana prior to this? Was there "something" going on with/between Usana and Lenny even back when he was defending them in 2007?

  2. #27
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Here is my summed up story regarding Len Clements' distributorship with USANA.

    On April 4, 2008 Len Clements went to lunch with USANA's James Bramble and Riley Timmer. After lunch, they took Len Clements to USANA's headquarters. When Len entered the lobby at USANA's headquarters, every employee was there to congratulate Len on defense of USANA against FDI's pyramid scheme allegations. They gave Len Clements a huge plaque for his work defending USANA against Barry Minkow, Robert Fitzpatrick, Jon Taylor, Tracy Coenen, New Zealand's NBR article, etc... During this visit, Len Clements discussed 1) work defending USANA against FDI, 2) Matching Bonus plan, 3) Deal to become distributor.

    1) The defending of USANA against FDI's allegations took place during the time Len was still employed at Zenza as Vice President of Market Research. While Len was doing this, he stopped doing work for Zenza while still being paid by Zenza. Eventually Zenza fired him. Whatever Len wrote on his website for his reasoning for leaving is untrue.

    2) USANA never had a matching bonus plan. Len introduced the idea to USANA. USANA bought into the idea and revised it a little bit. So Len knew on April 4, 2008 that a matching bonus plan will be implemented.

    3) Len Clements was "Given" an old distributor position. The original owner of the position had left years prior. This particular position is under Pete Zdanis, USANA's 4th top distirbutor in the world. This position had a completely maxed out leg while the other leg was empty. So all Len had to do was recruit people into only one leg. Len claims anyone could have obtained this position because it was done through USANA's Transfer of Distributorship policy. This is UNTRUE however because the original owner had left years prior! USANA is not allowed to GIVE their cronies a valuable distirbutor position. USANA broke their own rules to obtain Len as a distributor.

    Several months pass and USANA's annual convention is about to happen. It is the end of August. Just prior to the convention, Len Clements "officially" becomes a USANA distributor. Why did Len wait to become a distributor when he made the deal in April? Well, remember that Matching Bonus plan Len discussed with USANA? The Matching Bonus plan was announced during USANA's annual convention, so it could not start until the announcement. The matching bonus plan requires distributors to become "Platinum Pacesetter" to receive a 100% matching bonus (50% for just Pacesetters). In order to become Platinum Pacesetter, a distributor must recruit a certain number of distributors who all activate their business centers. So had Len joined on April 4, 2008 and recruited anyone, he would not be able to count those recruits in the matching bonus plan. Does that make sense?

    So what does Len do? Len recruits John Fogg and Brian Bier as distributors, both of whom he had previously recruited into ZENZA. Len also recruited his own brother. However, Len did not recruit enough people to become "Platinum" Pacesetter. So Len would not receive a 100% matching bonus from his Group Sales Volume. Because of this, Len left USANA to find another MLM (Yoli).

    It should be noted that when he recruited John Fogg as a DISTRIBUTOR, Zenza didn't like that very much. As a result, John Fogg was terminated by Zenza! However, Len has placed all the blame on ME for John Fogg being terminated by Zenza. Len claimed that because I disclosed the fact John Fogg was recruited into Len's downline, that I had caused John to be terminated as a Zenza Distributor. Len claims that John Fogg only joined because he wanted to purchase vitamins for his children. OH REALLY LEN? That makes it LENS FAULT for signing John Fogg up as a distributor instead of just a PREFERRED CUSTOMER. (This is why I have no respect for Len Clements and his behavior)

    Also, When Len joined USANA's distributorship, Len was added to USANA's "Author Accolades" list. Here is USANA's PDF Document showing Len Clements and his book "Case Closed": USANA ACCOLADE . The other individuals have been USANA distributors from the beginning of the company's existance. Anyone else here besides me believe Len was given a special deal that no other distributor is given when they join at the bottom of the pyramid scheme?

    So when Len leaves USANA, he joins Yoli as a founding distributor. Guess who he recruits into Yoli? John Fogg and Brian Bier. Why these two individuals follow Len around like they do is beyond me.

    Have any questions, please ask. I tried to sum up the entire story since the special April 4, 2008 day.

  3. #28
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Thanks very much for the detailed response. Very interesting. So Lenny did lie to the FTC. Why am I not surprised. I knew this deal with his distributorship and his relationship with Usana went much farther back than his "official" joining. If people had any clue of all the dirt and the backroom deals. It's as bad as politicians and politics. The heavy hitters in many of these MLMs are very cultish and inscestuous. They follow each other around like buzzards to the next road kill, and the fresh pickings of more gullible sheep. It's all about the timing and it's all very carefully planned out and orchestrated. They all know one another. It never ceases to amaze me just how dirty and slimey these people are. They lie their a***s off, cover their a***s, play games and the wording and the phraseology and the way they answer (don't really answer) questions, give out the half truths, all the hype and b.s., the deceptions, the deflections and the dodging. They are masters of it all. Nothing but sleezy con men who have never worked for or earned an honest dollar in their lives.
    Last edited by A Life Aloft; 06-25-2010 at 12:33 AM.

  4. #29
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by A Life Aloft View Post
    Do you know then, when Lenny really hooked up with them as opposed to when it was "announced"? When was he actually brought on board? How long was he in discussions with Usana prior to this? Was there "something" going on with/between Usana and Lenny even back when he was defending them in 2007?
    Len was officially brought on board as a distributor with USANA toward the end of August. But my previous posting to this shows his special day on April 4, 2008 which shows just how involved he was with USANA.

    He was in discussion with USANA back in April or May of 2007, just shortly after Barry Minkow's Fraud Discovery Institute released their fraud report about USANA.

    Something was definitely going on between Len and USANA when he was defending USANA against the FDI report. Len was contacting USANA and getting inside information about Denis Waitley, and a video showing Mark Shurtleff endorsing USANA during one of their annual conventions.

    Denis Waitley was one of USANA's board of directors (his ex-wife was a top distributor as well). It was revealed by FDI that Denis Waitley never received a Masters degree, even though he claimed he did in SEC filings. As for his Ph.D., it was shown to be obtained from La Jolla University, a Diploma Mill. Not only that, but the university that now holds La Jolla's records (school doesn't exist anymore) claims that Denis Waitley is NOT in their records.

    But Len makes the following claim in his first FDI rebuttal:
    Minkow also exploits the fact that La Jolla University, where Dr. Waitley earned his Doctorate (Ph.D.) degree, is no longer in existence and, it appears, neither are their records from the time Dr. Waitley was a student. Since the Private Eye Minkow hired to snoop into Waitley’s past was unable to verify his Ph.D., this means, according to Minkow, that it must be suspect as well. Since the dead can no longer defend themselves, Minkow was surely comfortable in referring to “Mr.” Waitley’s degree as coming from a “now defunct and never-accredited diploma mill."

    Ah, but the dead can sometimes defend themselves. Well, at least a dead University’s past president can. In a notarized affidavit63 supplied by Dr. Denis Muhilly, the president of La Jolla University from 1985 to 1991, the California State Department of Education issued La Jolla U. “Full Institutional Approval”. Dr. Muhilly alleges that the California SDE issued a statement asserting that such approval was comparable to “full accreditation”.64 He further verified that Dr. Waitley did indeed attend classes, produce a dissertation, and many people attended his graduation ceremony.
    This was not disclosed by anyone else but Len. So where did Len get this information? From USANA.

    Len also claims in his rebuttals that he contacts USANA for his information.

    The best one was when he asked USANA for the video evidence of Mark Shurtleff endorsing USANA and their products. This really shows Len's ignorance. Barry Minkow contacted Mark Shurtleff's office and asked his he has endorsed USANA during a speech he gave. They claim that Mark Shurtleff would not endorse any company. A follow up call was made and Mark Shurleff's office told FDI that Mark Shurtleff would never endorse a company. The allegation was that Shurtleff gave a speech at USANA's convention after receiving thousands of dollars for a campaign contribution.

    Then HERE COMES LEN!. Len misunderstood what the FDI report was stating. Len asked USANA for the video evidence of Mark Shurtleff's speech. Len edited out several minutes of the video in which Len claims Mark Shurtleff complains about his knee and consumes a USANA vitamin on stage. Len posted his edited version of the video on his website and claimed that Barry Minkow was wrong. Here's the funniest part. Len was claiming that Mark Shurtleff DID infact ENDORSE USANA! Len actually proved Barry correct and proved that Mark Shurtleff and his office aides LIED about Shurtleff's endorsement speech. Wasn't long after Len posted this video that USANA and Mark Shurtleff's office demand that the video be removed from the internet. Poof, the video was gone...

    Fortunately, I had previously saved a copy of the video and when it was removed from Len's website, I posted it on Youtube. So now everyone can see Mark Shurtleff's illegal endorsement of USANA. Illegal? Yes! Attorney Generals are forbidden to endorse a private company like USANA. Len believes that I am wrong and the attorney general is allowed to make endorsements to private companies. Len simply does not understand the laws or even how to read them. Watch the video for yourself!

    I hope this is enough information for tonight. It is late and I'm sleep typing...

  5. #30
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Cripes, what was I just saying about MLMers and Politicians! That video is really shocking, damning and a disgrace. While watching it, I kept thinking how much money did Usana chump over to him to pimp for them?

    I found my answer:

    "Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff: More suspect campaign contributions
    Posted by Tracy Coenen on November 26, 2008 · 6 Comments

    This isn’t the first time (and won’t be the last time) that a contribution to Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff’s campaign fund is followed by questionable activity. The latest allegations of impropriety involve a computer consulting company called DigitalBridge.

    On September 29, 2008, AG Shurtleff wrote a letter on his office’s letterhead to the National Association of Attorneys General, endorsing the services of DigitalBridge and providing the company’s contact information. This doesn’t sound like a big deal unless you consider that on September 18, 2008, DigitalBridge made a $10,000 contribution to Shurtleff’s campaign.

    Shurtleff denies any impropriety, but it’s a little hard to believe him when one examines his past behavior related to campaign contributions which appear to be more properly termed bribes.

    There’s the recent situation of a lucrative case awarded to law firm Siegfried & Jensen, which has contributed almost $60,000 to Shurtleff’s campaigns over the last eight years. There were no bids offered for the legal work, just proposals which Shurtleff reviewd.

    Shurtleff has also received significant contributions from the payday lending industry, which he has supported.

    There was the criminal fraud and racketerring case of Marc Sessions Jenson, for which Shurtleff is accused of bringing the charges as a personal favor to donor (and alleged victim) Ricke White. White’s wife gave Shurtleff’s campaign a total of $6,500 in the two years before the charges were brought.

    Then there’s Shurtleff’s endorsement of multi-level marketing company Usana Health Sciences.

    And of course, there’s the time Shurtleff wrote an untrue letter to Patrick Byrne (CEO of Overstock) about Sam Antar, who graciously provided free training to Shurtleff’s office. That letter followed a $5,000 campaign contribution by Overstock, and the letter was used in conjuction with an Overstock.com press release to smear Sam.

    And there’s Shurtleff’s wholehearted support for the multi-level marketing industry, with MLM companies coincidentally contributing $231,000 to Shurtleff’s campaigns between 2003 and 2007, and another $65,500 in 2008 alone.


    Shurtleff claims these are all coincidences. Have you ever seen a politicians with so many coincidences with similar characteristics? If it walks like a duck…"


    It gets worse from here:

    http://www.sequenceinc.com/fraudfile...mitting-fraud/
    Last edited by A Life Aloft; 06-25-2010 at 01:05 AM.

  6. #31
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by fastmoney View Post
    Has someone invited Lenny to this site?

    Maybe we should make him an admin here?
    You know Fast, the first suggestion is OK. The second one may get you "a death threat from the Mafia."
    GEORGE DRANICHAK - OWNER OF SCAM.COM, PORN MOGUL AND KING OF THE PORN SPAMMERS

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    If I did get one. I would still be 6 threats away from Lenny.. I am just trying to catch up.

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    If Clements goes out weally, weally late and is weally, weally quiet and is weally, weally lucky,

    he might just hear the noise made by what little remains of his credibility disapeewing into the night.

  9. #34
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Regarding Len Clements and the Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff fiasco, I wrote about it on my website when it all took place. http://www.mlmpyramid.com/Shurtleff_Endorses_USANA.html

    The information used to be on my old website geocities.com/terminatedramp, however, Geocities closed their free webhosting. So I had to move everything over to mlmpyramid.com. If you would rather I post the information from my website here, I can do that. I know when someone promotes their website, it can be distasteful. Sort of like when Len constantly refers to articles he wrote on his website when someone asks him a direct question about something on a forum. Instead of directly answering the question, you have to read through 40 pages of nonsense and then try to guess what his answer really is.

  10. #35
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Wow, I always knew Mark Shurtleff was a complete dirtbag but I had no idea it was this bad. I'm going to forward all of this to my dad. He was elected the representative for his county for the most recent caucus in Utah and is definitely a well known figure in the community. Actually... I might just post this on my facebook since a large portion of my friends are in Utah.

  11. #36
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by A Life Aloft View Post
    He was a Usana distributor.
    No, I wasn't. I joined Usana right before their convention in early September.

  12. #37
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by A Life Aloft View Post
    "Note: Nevada recently instituted a $200.00 a year Business License. Thus, Nevada requires (NRS 364A) all corporate entities to register for a Nevada Business License ($200.00 charge). Upon completing the form Nevada Secretary of State, mail it to us with your $200.00. If you are a home based business, not having an office for your specific new business, projecting or making less than $26,600.00, the Business License is waived. However, still fill the form out and tell them you are under exemption 003; send no money".

    Goodness, this is what Len expects to earn/what he actually does earn? You mean he lies, yet again? Say it isn't so!
    All my consulting, expert witness activity, speaking and training, and downline overrides, are paid to me directly as an independent contractor. MarketWave provides mostly free information. The only sales that go through it are those for my two books and three CDs.

    Having said that, it is interesting that the state displays an 003 exemption for my company. I need to call them in the morning and see how to get my $200 back.

    Len

  13. #38
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by USANAWatchDog View Post
    I am the one to uncover and post on the internet the information about Len Clement's USANA distributorship deal. If you have any specific questions regarding Len's USANA relationship, I can provide lots of answers. Most of this was discussed on the Scam.com forum, which apparently is gone forever now.
    Should any rational, objective person actually be reading this thread, please know that USANAWatchdog assisted Barry Minkow in his bash-n-cash short selling scheme against Usana (Minkow was paid at least $200,000 by short sellers to write a negative report on them, which did cause their stock top drop 15% in one day - Minkow made over $61,000 on his own put options on Usana). Usana was ultimately vindicated of all accusations against them (SEC investigation ended with no action taken, federal shareholder lawsuit dismissed on summary). USANAWatchdog is literally, clinically obsesses with destroying Usana and anyone who defends them - including me. Virtually everything he says about me is an outright lie, and what facts he gets right are grossly embellished. I've challenged him to address all of these issues on a live, recorded conference call and he always declines. I've tried debating him online for months in Usana's Yahoo financial board and elsewhere. He is utterly irrational in his agenda and cannot be reasoned with, no matter what evidence, logic or common sense you present to him.

    Len

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa View Post
    Wow, I always knew Mark Shurtleff was a complete dirtbag but I had no idea it was this bad. I'm going to forward all of this to my dad. He was elected the representative for his county for the most recent caucus in Utah and is definitely a well known figure in the community. Actually... I might just post this on my facebook since a large portion of my friends are in Utah.
    Yes, Lisa. Anonymous posters on internet message boards are really reliable sources of information. Especially one's with a pathologically obsessive agenda to single handedly destroy an entire company with 800+ employees that generates millions in annual state and federal tax revenue, and anyone who even indirectly supports them or dare tries to get in his way.

    You should definitely bring this to the attention of your dad.

    Len

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    Having said that, it is interesting that the state displays an 003 exemption for my company. I need to call them in the morning and see how to get my $200 back.

    Len
    You probably need it to pay the rent on your crappy little house...


    This Expert mlmer.. Well, no REAL expert I know, lives in a 1,322sq ft house, and drives a car worth $5k.. You really consider yourself an expert?

    On a serious note.. Do you feel bad at all for what you did to Yoli?

  16. #41
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    Question Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by fastmoney View Post
    If I did get one. I would still be 6 threats away from Lenny.. I am just trying to catch up.
    Can we get a breakdown on those 7 alleged death threats. Could it be this way?

    4 from MLMers who found out the Truth.

    2 from people Len meets on message boards.

    1 from a family member.

    Just wondering.

  17. #42
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    Should any rational, objective person actually be reading this thread, please know that USANAWatchdog assisted Barry Minkow in his bash-n-cash short selling scheme against Usana (Minkow was paid at least $200,000 by short sellers to write a negative report on them, which did cause their stock top drop 15% in one day - Minkow made over $61,000 on his own put options on Usana).
    I sent an email to Robert FitzPatrick in December of 2006 regarding USANA's 2005 distributor earnings report, which was not publicly disclosed at the time. Because Fitzpatrick analyzed other MLM earnings report in his E-book, I thought I would send him the document for USANA. He replied back regarding the calculations he came up with, and I then responded with my analysis of USANA's earnings document. That second email that I sent ended up appearing on the original FDI USANA report at the end of addendum 2.

    Because I emailed Robert Fitzpatrick, Len tries to imply that I took part of some short selling scheme. For starters, it is not illegal to short a stock. USANA was not able to prove the allegations in the report released by FDI to be false. USANA decided to sue FDI for some "Naked Short Selling" scheme. USANA was never able to prove any naked short selling was going on. Too bad for Len, I never shorted USANA's stock.


    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    Usana was ultimately vindicated of all accusations against them (SEC investigation ended with no action taken, federal shareholder lawsuit dismissed on summary).
    According to Len, the SEC also vindicated Barry Madoff when the SEC investigation ended with no action taken in 1992. Since 1999, the SEC repeatedly received requests to investigate Madoff's scheme, and the SEC ignored the issue. Remember, this is the same SEC that was recently caught watching PORN on your tax dollars instead of doing their job. The SEC did NOT vindicate USANA on "ALL" the allegations. USANA could not disprove any of the allegations. So what makes Len think that the SEC could disprove the allegations when USANA could not? And remember, the court required USANA pay Barry Minkow $142,510, and it was USANA who refused to provide the required discovery.


    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    USANAWatchdog is literally, clinically obsesses with destroying Usana and anyone who defends them - including me. Virtually everything he says about me is an outright lie, and what facts he gets right are grossly embellished.
    1) True or False? Len wrote several rebuttals against FDI while being paid a salary from ZENZA as a Vice President of Market Research for the United States. During this time, Len was not involved with ZENZA, and as a result was fired from ZENZA.

    2) True or False? Len had lunch with James Bramble and TIm Rilley on April 4th. After lunch they took Len back to USANA's headquarters.

    3) True or False? Len was greeted by USANA's employees in the lobby of the headquarters and awarded Len with a huge plaque for his defense of USANA against FDI.

    4) True or False? Len discussed with Corporate members the work he did defending USANA.

    5) True or False? Len discussed with USANA the idea and plans for a Matching Bonus Plan, which USANA slightly changed before implementing?

    6) True or False? Len was given Distributor ID #: 47278 which is a very old position under Pete-Zdanis. This position was originally owned by Christine Cunningham, who left the position several years prior to Len Clements receiving the position.

    7) True or False? The distributor Position Len Clements was given was a special case that no rule of USANA allowed. USANA's Transfer of Distributorship rule requires the original account owner to transfer their distributorship position to a new owner. However, since Christine Cunningham left years prior, it was infact USANA Corporate who gave Len the existing distributor position.

    8) True or False? This existing position given to Len Clements has one of the legs maxed out while the other leg was virtually empty. New distributors joining USANA start with both legs empty. For Len to be maxing out one of his legs, he had about 150 distributors on that leg.

    9) True or False? If Len joined USANA around the time he met with USANA on April 4, 2008, any of the people Len recruited would not have counted toward USANA's Matching Bonus Plan requirements which were implemented at USANA's annaul convention at the end of August.

    10) True or False? Since Len joined right before the annual convention at the end of August, any distributors he recruited would apply toward his matching bonus requirement to reach Platinum Pacesetter. Unfortunately for Len, he did not recruit enough people to reach Platinum Pacesetter (100% matching bonus), but instead only made Pacesetter (50% matching bonus).

    11) True or False? Len recruited his brother, John Fogg, and Brian Bier into USANA's Business Opportunity as distributors.

    12) True or False? It was Len's decision to place John Fogg into USANA's Distributorship instead of a Preferred Customer.

    13) True or False? John Fogg's ZENZA distributorship was terminated by ZENZA because Len Clements (Who originally recruited John Fogg and Briant Bier into ZENZA and paid a matching bonus for doing so, which makes Len a DISTRIBUTOR as well) recruited John Fogg into Len's downline as a DISTRIBUTOR. Len blames me for John Fogg's termination, but knows full and well who was truly responsible.

    14) True or False? Len left USANA and joined Yoli as a founding distributor with ID# 1000007, which can be shown from this YOLI Distributor List. Len Clements recruited John Fogg and Brian Bier into Yoli.


    Len claims that virtually everything I wrote about him are outright lies. He claims I embellish the truth. I'll let the reader decide.

    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    I've challenged him to address all of these issues on a live, recorded conference call and he always declines. I've tried debating him online for months in Usana's Yahoo financial board and elsewhere. He is utterly irrational in his agenda and cannot be reasoned with, no matter what evidence, logic or common sense you present to him.
    I will not participate in any live debate with Len Clements. So what? Written Debates offer far more credibility to the one writing the truth. People reading the debates can verify the claims. This cannot be done in an oral debate. I've responded to every single posting Len Clements has ever directed to me, but because my responses don't agree with his, he complains...
    Last edited by USANAWatchDog; 06-28-2010 at 12:37 PM. Reason: fixed code for [QUOTE]

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    Yes, Lisa. Anonymous posters on internet message boards are really reliable sources of information. Especially one's with a pathologically obsessive agenda to single handedly destroy an entire company with 800+ employees that generates millions in annual state and federal tax revenue, and anyone who even indirectly supports them or dare tries to get in his way.

    You should definitely bring this to the attention of your dad.

    Len
    There is a video of Utah's AG clearly endorsing a product, something that he is NOT allowed to do by state law in regards to his position. This isn't about being anti-MLM, nor it is about Usana's posts or anyone else's. For me, it's about the Attorney General of my home state not doing his job like he's supposed to. And it goes deeper than this, in Utah not only are more fraudulent MLM's allowed to grow than anywhere else in the US (as well as real estate scams), they allow payday loan places to pop up everywhere and put almost NO restrictions on them and more. Utah's Attorney General doesn't give a crap about protecting consumers, he just cares about $$ in his pockets.

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa View Post
    There is a video of Utah's AG clearly endorsing a product, something that he is NOT allowed to do by state law in regards to his position. This isn't about being anti-MLM, nor it is about Usana's posts or anyone else's. For me, it's about the Attorney General of my home state not doing his job like he's supposed to. And it goes deeper than this, in Utah not only are more fraudulent MLM's allowed to grow than anywhere else in the US (as well as real estate scams), they allow payday loan places to pop up everywhere and put almost NO restrictions on them and more. Utah's Attorney General doesn't give a crap about protecting consumers, he just cares about $$ in his pockets.
    That sounds very bad.

    Utah - the home of Yoli. What a coincidence.

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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Live&Learn View Post
    That sounds very bad.

    Utah - the home of Yoli. What a coincidence.
    Utah is the home of a LOT of juice MLM's (Xango sponsors Real Salt Lake - their soccer team). What I never understood is how all these juice companies say how they have the freshest acai berry or whatever fruit it is that they use in their drinks, but Utah is a desert. It's really hard to get much fruit to grow there at all. What I think they mean to say is the freshest freeze dried fruit, which isn't the same as fresh fruit.

    When I lived in Utah it was not uncommon for someone to approach my husband or I with a "business opportunity" and try and use the LDS religion as a promotion tool. I also worked for a company that helped with real estate investors looking to do short sales. The company is no longer in business but it worked with another company based out of Provo that would sell people mentoring packages and all this other stuff to help them learn how to invest in real estate for thousands of dollars (some packages are over $10k). I learned that a lot of the information they were selling you could find for free and that their "mentors" were primarily BYU students and other young people who had never spent a day investing in real estate. The packages were a complete and total rip off and they scammed people out of thousands of dollars. They made getting refunds incredibly difficult and I can't even remember how many times I tried helping people who would contact our company trying to get their money back because they realized the whole program was a sham.

    I also worked for an online payday loan company that is no longer in business because it was violating laws in other states in regards to the amount of interest that they were charing on the loans ($20 per $100 loaned). The guy who owned it also STILL owns 3 payday loan places with the same interest rates that other state Attorney General's have found to be too high and sued over.

  21. #46
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by MWave View Post
    ... Having said that, it is interesting that the state displays an 003 exemption for my company. I need to call them in the morning and see how to get my $200 back.

    Len
    If you get your $200 back, maybe you can apply it to your MENSA membership that I'm led to believe is in arrears.

    On your website you claim: Member - Mensa Society (155 IQ)

    I don't know how to put this politely other than to say you're lying.

    If you owe the folks at MENSA money because you haven't paid your dues, then no, you're not a member.
    Len Clements: Mensa Society (155 IQ)

    Stephen Hawking: "People who boast about their IQ are losers."

  22. #47
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Live&Learn View Post
    That sounds very bad.

    Utah - the home of Yoli. What a coincidence.
    MLMs have a home in Utah.

    Since the video has been posted and commented on, Shurtleff was reelected in 2008 and it is now 2010.

    Don't get me wrong, I am anti-MLM and anti-ethical violations for politicians. It appears he is running for the US Senate in 2010.

    Anyone know what his chances are?
    A half-truth is a whole lie.

  23. #48
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Emet View Post
    MLMs have a home in Utah.

    Since the video has been posted and commented on, Shurtleff was reelected in 2008 and it is now 2010.

    Don't get me wrong, I am anti-MLM and anti-ethical violations for politicians. It appears he is running for the US Senate in 2010.

    Anyone know what his chances are?
    No, it's Mike Lee. It was between Mike Lee and Tim Bridgewater. Since Lee will be the Republican nominee it's pretty much guaranteed he'll win.

  24. #49
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Lisa View Post
    No, it's Mike Lee. It was between Mike Lee and Tim Bridgewater. Since Lee will be the Republican nominee it's pretty much guaranteed he'll win.
    Thanks, Lisa. I had seen his page about running for Senate, and missed that he had suspended his campaign. I don't follow Utah politics that closely.

    According to his Wikipedia page, he was the first Utah AG to win reelection for a third term. So can/will he run again when his term expires? Is he popular?
    A half-truth is a whole lie.

  25. #50
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    Re: MarketWave, Inc. - Len Clements

    Quote Originally Posted by Emet View Post
    Thanks, Lisa. I had seen his page about running for Senate, and missed that he had suspended his campaign. I don't follow Utah politics that closely.

    According to his Wikipedia page, he was the first Utah AG to win reelection for a third term. So can/will he run again when his term expires? Is he popular?
    It depends. A lot of people in Utah right now are very anti-incumbent, and as long as this sentiment is still around in 2012 then I think there's a chance he might lose. However, if he goes unchallenged again as the primary Republican in 2012 then I highly doubt he'll lose. He ran unchallenged in both 2004 and 2008, and generally speaking as long as you have a little (R) next to your name in Utah it pretty much guarantees you'll win. To give you a sample of the sentiment of politics in Utah, in high school the guy who was running as the Republican representative to represent our area in the state Senate visited my debate class. He told us to always vote along party lines and to always vote Republican. The guy gave us ZERO explanation of why we should do that, though, and those of us who participated in the more political aspects of debate just laughed at him. I think one of my classmates told him he was an idiot. However, a lot of people in Utah do simply vote along party lines. Salt Lake County is really the only place where a Democrat has much of a chance at a political career, the rest of the state is SUPER conservative.

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